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autotrnslucence's profile
Jessica Watson Miller
Jessica Watson Miller
Jessica Watson Miller
@autotrnslucence

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Jessica Watson Miller

@autotrnslucence

Crypto PM. Salon over soapbox. Maybe a metarationalist or something. How do we improve large-scale human collaboration?

San Francisco, USA
autotranslucence.wordpress.com
Joined January 2017

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    Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10

    Where do legitimacy and authority come from in metamodern OR fluid institutions?

    3:46 PM - 10 Sep 2018
    • 8 Likes
    • K M matthaus ansatz Candy Corn Woman Nathan Snyder Jason Snyder Molten Steel simpolism
    12 replies 0 retweets 8 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10

        My worry is that its purely something circular - that the stories/structures that are the most meaningful are the ones that manage to feel the most meaningful for the biggest groups of people.

        3 replies 1 retweet 7 likes
        Show this thread
      3. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10

        Or possibly, the ability to play with/unify existing structures of power, which still boils down to charisma/bureaucracy/tradition/resources. Is there something else? Something new?

        1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        Show this thread
      4. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Toby‏ @tobyshorin Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        Can't those institutions have regular hierarchies of power while not being dogmatic?

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10
        Replying to @tobyshorin

        Yeah sure, but where do those at the top get their power from? If it's just 'they won the bureaucratic game' then these systems are identical to modern ones. Tradition-based hierarchies aren't in rn. My worry is it's charisma-based ones next. Eugh.

        3 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
      4. Toby‏ @tobyshorin Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        Hmm I'm not sure if I understand your framing. Are you looking for the power model of institutions in a metamodern age? Or the authority and governance structure inside metamodern institutions?

        3 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      5. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10
        Replying to @tobyshorin

        Either would be great, thanks

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      6. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Self′‏ @selfprime Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        I'm half way through reading this book. It has some interesting real world examples: https://www.amazon.com/Reinventing-Organizations-Creating-Inspired-Consciousness-ebook/dp/B00ICS9VI4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1536624804&sr=8-1&keywords=reinventing+organizations …

        1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      3. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10
        Replying to @selfprime

        Oooh, this is the second time this book has come up. Seems like I might need to read it then...

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      4. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Self′‏ @selfprime Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        Institutions are inherently meaningful and embody some value system so their very existence avoids the groundless pomo trap.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10
        Replying to @selfprime

        But if a modern institution embodies a static set of values (or a set we pretend are static), how does a fluid institution embody a changing set of values without collapsing into nihilism?

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Self′‏ @selfprime Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        If it’s an institution and it exists it has values otherwise it will cease to exist. If those values change a lot the people engaging in it will likely turnover. A successful startup is maybe an example of an organization with shifting values. Most early employees will churn.

        0 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
      5. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Dan Garfield‏ @danlistensto Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        Consent of the governed? It's a modern idea but I don't see it as obsolete.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10
        Replying to @danlistensto

        But what leads people to consent to being governed?

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Dan Garfield‏ @danlistensto Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        Belief that their interests are being represented. This interacts heavily with social norms, signaling behavior, propaganda, and all kinds of other distortions on belief formation.

        0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      5. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Visakan Veerasamy‏ @visakanv Sep 11
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        I think the short answer might be something like “loosely-held lip service to convention”. Nobody has the time/energy to re-evaluate and re-construct everything from first principles, so they innovate on some front + use legacy ‘code’ for everything else until it becomes an issue

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      3. Visakan Veerasamy‏ @visakanv Sep 11
        Replying to @visakanv @autotrnslucence

        Visakan Veerasamy Retweeted Jessica Watson Miller

        Yup I think it’s exactly this. “Solving for adoption” is a challenge, otherwise you have the “Esperanto problem” where you might have a superior system that nobody wants to adopt because nobody has adopted it yethttps://twitter.com/autotrnslucence/status/1039285828629889024?s=21 …

        Visakan Veerasamy added,

        Jessica Watson Miller @autotrnslucence
        Or possibly, the ability to play with/unify existing structures of power, which still boils down to charisma/bureaucracy/tradition/resources. Is there something else? Something new?
        Show this thread
        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      4. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 11
        Replying to @visakanv

        I think that structures that pretend there’s one true source of meaning might have an advantage of focus - they can laser in on one thing, like growth, and in that way best structures that are more responsive/realistic.

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      5. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Molten Steel‏ @_molten_steel_ Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        Not enough existing rn, so it's hard to say. I'd start with "Rough consensus and running code" among open source devs

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Jessica Watson Miller‏ @autotrnslucence Sep 10
        Replying to @_molten_steel_

        Is running code roughly equivalent to 'the ability to make things happen in the world'? Because that seems to just boil down to charisma, bureaucracy, tradition and resources a la weber.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Molten Steel‏ @_molten_steel_ Sep 10
        Replying to @autotrnslucence

        I think the idea is that you can do those things but without the formal structure Or switch between formal structure and informal modes more easily? Maybe we can find something if we look at the cracks in Weber's model, but I'm not that familiar with him

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      5. End of conversation

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