Like that's how cycles of revenge *work* - they are fueled by what someone "deserves" at the hands of the wronged party. And that's what I meant when I said I can understand why people are irritated - Abby comes out of things way better despite having started the whole cycle.
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Replying to @loudpenitent @mssilverstein
Which is why I compare the game to Unforgiven "Deserve's got nothing to do with it"
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I guess this just underscores how controversial the ending of the first game is because the whole "Who started it?" question is central to where your sympathies lie in TLoU2
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
And that question can't be answered without answering all the other questions raised by TLoU 1 If dissecting Ellie is a justifiable and necessary act then the Fireflies were, in fact, innocent and Joel's massacre is an act of murder He started it
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
If it's unjustifiable no matter what in your view, then yes, everyone at the hospital is a murderer or an accessory, Joel was heroically trying to save his daughter, and Abby is the one who fires the first shot in the exchange by killing an innocent man for no good reason
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
These two viewpoints are, I think, irreconcilable and they're very very strongly skewed by people's growing dislike of trolley problem scenarios in games like this and willingness to just go ahead and side with the characters who have names and top billing in the cast
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
I feel like if we're gonna get Geneva Conventions involved here we have to come back to the idea that those Conventions were for sovereign nations seen as equals who were all the rightful government of their country It doesn't apply to criminals
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
It's like, if some rando kidnaps your daughter and threatens to cut her up for some insane reason, the kidnapper and his friends aren't a country, they don't get Geneva Convention protections, you can fuck them up any way you want in order to save her
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
Contrarily, if some scientists in a hospital are desperately trying to cure the plague that killed the planet, and some nihilistic asshole decides the planet should die instead, why should he and his friends get any legal protection in their quest to murder all of humanity
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Replying to @arthur_affect @BootlegGirl and
(And this is why many would argue the Geneva Conventions as written were always unstable and flawed - the whole Eddie Izzard "You're allowed to kill your own people, that's what it means for them to be your own people" thing
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Like are people really broken up about the idea of committing war crimes to put a stop to the Holocaust Does Hitler get the benefit of being the legitimate ruler of his sovereign nation)
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Absolutely not. Which is why I was shocked to learn the Geneva Conventions don't cover cops, but then I was also raised on, as I mentioned, "US humanitarian intervention is good". Like my dad would get along with that b*ppin guy.
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Replying to @BootlegGirl @arthur_affect and
I always assumed that if someone is doing crimes against humanity against their own citizens, that's causus belli. (Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri also lied to me about this.)
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