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__agwa's profile
Andrew Ayer
Andrew Ayer
Andrew Ayer
@__agwa

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Andrew Ayer

@__agwa

Founder of @SSLMate, author of Cert Spotter. I do #webpki and #CertificateTransparency stuff.

San Francisco Bay Area
agwa.name
Joined November 2011

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    1. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11

      @sleevi_ Does Chrome outright reject redacted certificates at the moment? Is there a place/page where this is documented/explained?

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11

      Or is it that redacted certs simply won’t be CT compliant and that there’s no need to look for redaction specifically?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Show this thread
    3. Ryan Sleevi‏ @sleevi_ Apr 11
      Replying to @ivanristic

      More than that - Redaction is active misissuance, and will be treated like any other active and knowing BR violation. They won’t be accepted by clients, BUT ALSO the CA has now misissued

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    4. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11
      Replying to @sleevi_

      Thanks for the clarification. Let me rephrase the question: is there any code in Chrome that rejects redacted certificates specifically (in absence of any other problems)?

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    5. Andrew Ayer‏ @__agwa Apr 11
      Replying to @ivanristic @sleevi_

      There is no redaction in CT. Symantec just made stuff up by mis-issuing a pre-cert for ?.example.com and embedding its SCT in a cert for http://sub.example.com . That doesn't work, just as an SCT for http://yahoo.com  obviously doesn't work for http://google.com .

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    6. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11
      Replying to @__agwa @sleevi_

      And yet here’s one redacted precertificate in a CT log :) https://crt.sh/?q=997aeb30aeb419a0892de5b6831de56291ca110411bf13fd3dae713a2b54e78c …

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. Ryan Sleevi‏ @sleevi_ Apr 11
      Replying to @ivanristic @__agwa

      ... I’m not sure what you’re highlighting? That’s entirely consistent with what we said. It was a misissued certificate.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11
      Replying to @sleevi_ @__agwa

      I was replying to @__agwa saying that there is no redaction in CT. There is, it’s just that there shouldn’t be.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Andrew Ayer‏ @__agwa Apr 11
      Replying to @ivanristic @sleevi_

      But there isn't. There is no published spec that says how that pre-certificate for ?.badssl.com could match a final certificate for anything other than ?.badssl.com.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11
      Replying to @__agwa @sleevi_

      Well, in my experience with PKI, it’s not a requirement for something to be specified to work in practice. And the opposite happens to, specified things often don’t work.

      1 reply 1 retweet 1 like
      Andrew Ayer‏ @__agwa Apr 11
      Replying to @ivanristic @sleevi_

      TLS clients need explicit support for redaction because of how SCT signatures work. Without explicit support, the SCT will have an invalid signature. No different than if you tried to use a http://yahoo.com  SCT with a http://google.com  cert.

      3:17 PM - 11 Apr 2018
      • 2 Likes
      • Albert Lunde Vincent Lynch
      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11
          Replying to @__agwa @sleevi_

          I never mentioned CT in my question! I merely wanted to know if Chrome actively tried to detect “redacted” certificates. For example, looking the 1.3.101.77 extension. I never got a reply to that, but both of you went on to explain to me how CT works :)

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Ryan Sleevi‏ @sleevi_ Apr 11
          Replying to @ivanristic @__agwa

          That’s just an OID off the Thawte arc though, and doesn’t appear in the final cert - so what would be rejected? Certs that aren’t CT qualified? We already did that for SYMC certs. Not because of redaction tho, except incidentally

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. Ivan Ristic‏ @ivanristic Apr 11
          Replying to @sleevi_ @__agwa

          There’s 1.3.101.77 in the cert on https://invalid-expected-sct.badssl.com  My questions may have obvious answers to you, but that’s because you’re on the inside. From the outside, lots of stuff appears as random. I don’t even try to understand “why”, understanding behaviour is difficult enough :)

          1 reply 2 retweets 2 likes
        5. Ryan Sleevi‏ @sleevi_ Apr 11
          Replying to @ivanristic @__agwa

          Ah right, forgot about the redacted commitment thing. In any event, understanding the why is the key to understanding or predicting the behavior :) Understanding the SCTs don’t match and Symantec/new certs need to be CT qualified makes it clear the rejection ;)

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. End of conversation
        1. Andrew Ayer‏ @__agwa Apr 11
          Replying to @__agwa @ivanristic @sleevi_

          Kind of like how clients need explicit support for wildcard identifiers. If a client doesn't know about wildcards, a cert for *.example.com isn't going to work except for literally *.example.com.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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