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WinterwolvesG's profile
WinterWolves Games
WinterWolves Games
WinterWolves Games
@WinterwolvesG

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WinterWolves Games

@WinterwolvesG

Visual novels, dating sims, RPG! LGBTQ friendly :) Exclusive pin-ups and more in our Patreon: http://patreon.com/winterwolves  NSFW account: @GamesNSFW

Italy
winterwolves.com
Joined January 2009

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    1. Gareth Fouche‏ @GarethFouche Apr 30

      We're all building products that, if we're lucky, grow far out of proportion to the amount of actual labor we put in. Devs, imagine a customer came to you and said "since I'm your hundred thousandth customer, I expect you to give me the game for 50% off. You've made enough."

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Show this thread
    2. Gareth Fouche‏ @GarethFouche Apr 30

      "You've sold a million copies, now give it to us for free." Yeah, no. Most of us would laugh and tell them to piss off. The worth of a thing is based on what the customer gets out of it and what competition there is, not directly relative to input labor.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      Show this thread
    3. Gareth Fouche‏ @GarethFouche Apr 30

      Steam ups my sales 10x, takes 30% of that, leaving me with a net gain of a 7x increase in sales. So that's worth it. Of course, I'll happily take any better rate that offers me even better value. But it's ludicrous to pretend it isn't valuable, what you get for their 30% cut.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      Show this thread
    4. Tom Grochowiak‏ @TomGrochowiak Apr 30
      Replying to @GarethFouche

      The other way to look at this is that Steam doesn't increase your sales vs other sources but decreases theirs. This has very much been our experience (except it was more like 100x).

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Tom Grochowiak‏ @TomGrochowiak Apr 30
      Replying to @TomGrochowiak @GarethFouche

      If you look at Steam now, it dwarfs other stores for sure. But I still remember times before Valve gained a true monopoly, when those stores were actually a very real source of income. Damn, even our direct sales were in the tens of thousands and then dropped to near 0.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Gareth Fouche‏ @GarethFouche Apr 30
      Replying to @TomGrochowiak

      Sure, but that's because customers chose to go there. That doesn't change the fact that, now that Steam has all the customers, you're getting access to those customers for your 30%. You're not getting nothing as a dev just because valve support emails are slow.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Tom Grochowiak‏ @TomGrochowiak Apr 30
      Replying to @GarethFouche

      I thing the "customers chose to go there" thing is a bit more complex. Customers chose to go to Walmart over their local groceries for convenience, but also because Walmart uses its size and damping prices to push those out of business.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Gareth Fouche‏ @GarethFouche Apr 30
      Replying to @TomGrochowiak

      Maybe. But I dunno that Steam has priced everyone else out of business using economies of scale, so I dunno if that's it. I didn't see that happening.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Tom Grochowiak‏ @TomGrochowiak Apr 30
      Replying to @GarethFouche

      It's slowly boiling the frog imho. First they opened Steam up for indies with a huge visibility boost. Then they let you handle out keys to your existing customers. Then they opened it up more and more until the guaranteed visibility stopped being part of the deal. (1/2)

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    10. Tom Grochowiak‏ @TomGrochowiak Apr 30
      Replying to @TomGrochowiak @GarethFouche

      Then they introduced the "Steam gotta have the best price" rule. Then they stopped handing out keys so easioly or at all. And so on... So the deal got worse and worse, but your own customers have already became their customers and you can't back out. It's a bit slimy.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      WinterWolves Games‏ @WinterwolvesG Apr 30
      Replying to @TomGrochowiak @GarethFouche

      also things changed for worse a lot in recent times. So if you just released a game before 2018... nope. That was a different Steam!

      4:39 AM - 30 Apr 2021
      • 2 Likes
      • Tom Grochowiak Gareth Fouche
      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Gareth Fouche‏ @GarethFouche Apr 30
          Replying to @WinterwolvesG @TomGrochowiak

          Yeah. Have to keep in mind there's been a bunch of changes that happened simultaneously, obviously. Rise of free game engines = 100x the competition.

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        3. WinterWolves Games‏ @WinterwolvesG Apr 30
          Replying to @GarethFouche @TomGrochowiak

          yes I don't know the reasons, algorithm, more people developing, whatever. But for sure, vs 2018 it's already a HUGE change!

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. End of conversation

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