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Good arguments, and I agree, but my point is less about their embrace of Peterson himself, and more the paucity of alternative, more respectable, less unhinged options. Is this the best they can do?

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Cinder

@Triquetrea

Nov 13, 2018

Replying to @Triquetrea and @Grimeandreason

Peterson says weird conservative stuff on a fairly regular basis, but his actual politics are neolib even on social issues. He's a hardcore moderate, scared of turning dials. So establishment embracing him is totally unsurprising. It maintains a veneer of ideological openness.

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Peterson is just more interesting than the usual suspects. Who even remembers the typical talking heads? If you mean the lack of charismatic alternatives, then yes, that makes perfect sense. Right is energised & networked. Left is scattered and infighting. The Center is dying.

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The system will spit out multiples of Petersons and people further right for every Corbyn.

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Oh, the ratio is like 50:1 in that respect, in neoliberal hegemonies, anyway.

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It's not really a hegemony if it can't sustain itself, is it? The nativists and fascists are already pouncing. Saw someone wanting to throw Spain out of the EU over criminalising the Catalan referendum. Problem is, they'd have to also throw out Slovakia, CR, Poland and Hungary.

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The EU is the closer WRE analogue I'd you regard it as more of a mercantile empire. It has shown some ability to project force (Greece), but it's overstretched and burdened by corruption, infighting and weak leaders. Moreso than the US.

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No one has explained to me yet how the EU goes left to avoid fascism and climate breakdown when fascists and climate deniers hold veto powers. What worked in good times doesn't work in times of collapse. History is pretty clear about that.

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Yeah. I'd be more excited about Corbyn, Varoufakis et al. if I didn't have to imagine them lined up in front of a firing squad... People mock the low number of actual fascists as if they need more than 10% to take over under the 'right' circumstances.

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Exactly. In terms of organisation & leadership, the western left is still in its tiny after basically being obliterated. Not exactly the most resilient network in the world. But then, it's gonna take something unprecedented to avoid catastrophe, & that'll likely be bottom-up.

Cinder

@Triquetrea

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@Grimeandreason

Expect change when the bottom gets flooded, i.e. as soon as crops in India or GMO monocultures start failing. This is why I think

@iwelsh

is right about a projected death toll of billions. We will only act when tens of millions are dead. The cascades will only just have begun.

12:02 PM · Nov 13, 2018Twitter Web App

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I fear so.

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People in Europe will react when the problems in Africa and Asia pop out of their boxes and people start flooding the borders. Syria is a tiny country, and we can see how well *that* went.

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Well sure, if the West responds by flooding every area that revolts with arms for proxy fundamentalists as they did in Syria, the world is in for a whole load of shit. A collapsing core this time doesn't guarantee that colonial states come out still on top though, IMO.

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I keep saying that is part of the plan

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@mwiik

Oct 9, 2018

❝❛Aftermath... anticipates a global population reduction of between 20 and 35 percent❜. This is described as not only an inevitability but a necessity.❞ —Harry Pierce (character in _Spooks_) twitter.com/mwiik/status/9…