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TomRittervg's profile
Tom Ritter
Tom Ritter
Tom Ritter
@TomRittervg

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Tom Ritter

@TomRittervg

Crypto, Privacy, Pseudonymity & Anonymity, @ Mozilla

ritter.vg
Joined November 2008

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    1. Alex Stamos‏Verified account @alexstamos Sep 28
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @dude313123123 @SteveBellovin

      My argument is that E2E needs to make money if we want it to exist for billions of people five years from now.

      4 replies 2 retweets 11 likes
    2. Matthew Green‏ @matthew_d_green Sep 28
      Replying to @alexstamos @dude313123123 @SteveBellovin

      And *my* argument is that yes, it does. It can’t run as charity. But the actual amount of money it needs to make to cover costs and make a profit is not that high, unless you’re trying to satisfy Facebook shareholders.

      6 replies 1 retweet 20 likes
    3. Steve Weis‏ @sweis Sep 28
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @alexstamos @SteveBellovin

      WhatsApp's original business model was: 1st year free, $1/year afterward. That seems completely viable if people stick on the platform and your expenses don't bloat.

      1 reply 0 retweets 14 likes
    4. Matthew Green‏ @matthew_d_green Sep 28
      Replying to @sweis @alexstamos @SteveBellovin

      And they were actually profitable in that model, as @FredericJacobs points out.

      1 reply 0 retweets 7 likes
    5. zooko‏ @zooko Sep 28
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @sweis and

      I think this model — the one that they can be "profitable" in — is a closed-loop model, and I like it! I think the other idea "How much does it cost? How could we come up with that much?" is thinking about an open-loop model and isn't going to help much.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    6. zooko‏ @zooko Sep 28
      Replying to @zooko @matthew_d_green and

      BTW I've been thinking a *lot* about this because of Zcash. Zcash Co is currently in what I think of as a closed-loop model: we get more and more funding every month if Zcash is more and more valuable that month. …

      1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
    7. zooko‏ @zooko Sep 28
      Replying to @zooko @matthew_d_green and

      … Zcash Foundation could be perceived [*] as a non-profit with an endowment. You have $50M in the bank. How much would it cost to produce X and Y value for the world. Open-loop. I don't think that is a very promising path forward. …

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    8. zooko‏ @zooko Sep 28
      Replying to @zooko @matthew_d_green and

      … (BTW Matt is on the Board of Directors of Zcash Foundation.) …

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    9. zooko‏ @zooko Sep 28
      Replying to @zooko @matthew_d_green and

      … An open-loop/endowment/philanthropy/non-profit model might be good for some things. Especially for longevity. Mozilla has endured for decades where Netscape didn't. Internet Archive endures. We need that. But I don't think open-loop models can scale product to 1b users. …

      4 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
    10. BrendanEich‏Verified account @BrendanEich Sep 28
      Replying to @zooko @matthew_d_green and

      Mozilla endured by big search traffic revshare deals, almost all with Google. Not by donations.

      3 replies 9 retweets 32 likes
      Tom Ritter‏ @TomRittervg Sep 28
      Replying to @BrendanEich @zooko and

      Right. I think Mozilla is better described as closed loop since the more popular our product is the more revenue we get.

      3:54 PM - 28 Sep 2018
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. BrendanEich‏Verified account @BrendanEich Sep 28
          Replying to @TomRittervg @zooko and

          Until revenue generation (not share from partner) comes from inside the closed system, that approach is fragile. Google did Chrome to reduce TAC, Chrome is still growing per statcounter&netmarketshare, most other browsers losing share. Market loss + traffic-scaled deal no good.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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