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TimSweeneyEpic's profile
Tim Sweeney
Tim Sweeney
Tim Sweeney
@TimSweeneyEpic

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Tim Sweeney

@TimSweeneyEpic

Epic Games founder & CEO

epicgames.com
Joined August 2013

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    1. Tim Sweeney‏ @TimSweeneyEpic Feb 1
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      Programming languages without garbage collection send us down a long path of design decisions that lead to slow compile times and fragile runtime performance cliffs.

      30 replies 41 retweets 356 likes
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    2. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Feb 1
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      Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic

      Strong disagree. C++ is slow for reasons that are entirely fixable if you change the compilation model. Rust is slow for some of those reasons, plus some others. I have to say I don't understand, though, what your "array of integers" example represents in the general case.

      3 replies 2 retweets 86 likes
    3. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Feb 1
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @TimSweeneyEpic

      i.e. I am not sure what concrete programming problem that is supposed to represent and why it's a problem.

      1 reply 0 retweets 17 likes
    4. BrendanEich‏Verified account @BrendanEich Feb 1
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @TimSweeneyEpic

      Whether and how to implement generics.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    5. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Feb 1
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      Replying to @BrendanEich @TimSweeneyEpic

      Right, what I don't understand is what part of the problem is not solved by having generics.

      1 reply 0 retweets 6 likes
    6. Lúcás Meier‏ @cronokirby Feb 1
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @BrendanEich @TimSweeneyEpic

      Monomorphized generics come with a heavy cost in terms of compile time.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Feb 1
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      Replying to @cronokirby @BrendanEich @TimSweeneyEpic

      I don't find this to be the case. I mean yes, you are compiling more functions, but those cost the same as your regular functions, so, if that's cheap, you are okay.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      Tim Sweeney‏ @TimSweeneyEpic Feb 1
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @cronokirby @BrendanEich

      Most C++ codebases have grown to the point where compile times aren't ok, and mostly that's due to the combinatorial increase in compile times from instantiation of families of templated types and functions.

      10:53 AM - 1 Feb 2020
      • 3 Likes
      • Amirhossein Mirtabatabaeipour K32n31 P4n1c Michał Siejak
      5 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
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        2. Tim Sweeney‏ @TimSweeneyEpic Feb 1
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          Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic @Jonathan_Blow and

          It's not that instantiating vector<t> is slow. It's that all of ancillary things like map<vector<t>,function<t,u>> or whatever grow combinatorially. And mostly these exist because of missing subtyping relations, especially of the missing universal type.

          2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
        3. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow Feb 1
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          Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic @cronokirby @BrendanEich

          This combinatorial aspect is definitely there, but, C++ compilation times are *way* slower than they would be with a better compilation model ... superlinearly so. If big programs compiled 1000x faster, would this feel like as big a problem?

          1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
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        1. Luca Sas‏ @SasLuca Feb 1
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          Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic @Jonathan_Blow and

          I actually found compilers for garbage collected langs to be even slower than C++ ones (eg: typescript or java on android) With C/C++ you can at least architect your codebase such that it compiles fast. Jon's lang has very impressive compile times so clearly its not impossible.

          0 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
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        1. Igor Bukanov‏ @fpoling Feb 1
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          Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic @Jonathan_Blow and

          The slow part in C++ comes mostly from repeated parsing of included STL headers with complicated and mostly unused C++ templates. C++ modules should address that. In the mean time use jumbo builds or other tricks that can cut the build time by factor of 3.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        1. New conversation
        2. KS Sreeram‏ @kssreeram Feb 2
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          Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic @Jonathan_Blow and

          I suspect the real problem is that you don’t control the language and compiler. When you have a sufficiently large core base, using a custom language and compiler opens up a new set of levers that help in solving problems like compile times.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. KS Sreeram‏ @kssreeram Feb 2
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          Replying to @kssreeram @TimSweeneyEpic and

          What I said may sound crazy, but I’ve been going down that path for many years now and the results appear promising.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation
        1. Ciprian Stanciu‏ @relativegames Feb 1
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          Replying to @TimSweeneyEpic @Jonathan_Blow and

          Good thing you brought this up. Now in UE4, why is there so much code in headers as opposed to .cpps ? And secondly, can we know how much faster UE4 would compile if there weren't any Class.generated.h/cpp ?

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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