@Meaningness do you have anything on 'paths in' to metarationality?
Seems to me that AI ought to help to get you there... cybernetics ought to help to get you there... architecture (thinking about Negroponte and 'architecture machine group'), perhaps art, perhaps ethics...
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Replying to @antlerboy
Sorry to be slow to reply—I lost track of this! All the things you mention, yes. I haven’t written anything very specific, and you’ve probably seen everything I have written. There’s supposed to be more in the Eggplant book, but it’s not a major theme there either. Future work!
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Replying to @Meaningness @antlerboy
I guess this is the closest thing:https://meaningness.com/metablog/meta-rationality-curriculum …
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Replying to @Meaningness @antlerboy
Generically, one way or another, you need to first come to master systematic thinking; and then, through experience, to recognize its limitations. And then re-think how and why systematicity works (when it does).
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Replying to @Meaningness
So I think the longer version is messier than this - rational frame (embedded in life/practice/stage of life), breakdown... And each time either a new rational frame, or despair, or blind faith(/cargo cultism), or metarationality, or...
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Replying to @antlerboy @Meaningness
...perhaps Incipient metarationality scaffolded from bits of multiple previous frames that still work and new interpretations of bits that don't.
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Replying to @antlerboy @Meaningness
(And the reason Macintyre is an interesting case is he talks about this at a world/cultural level *and* he himself visibly progresses through a journey in his life/work)
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Replying to @antlerboy @Meaningness
I would bet that Jacques' levels of thinking - given he was the man who coined the very relevant term 'midlife crisis' - would reflect this. So give praise to manipulative gurus, bad marriages and received religion, for they reliably precipitate epistemological crises?
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Replying to @antlerboy
It would be great if they actually were reliable! Usually, they are unmitigated disasters. Such crises may be necessary, but definitely not sufficient. What enables some people to learn from an epistemological breakdown, to move to metasystematicity?
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Western hermeticism (following Masonry to some extent) tried to create a formal framework for it, via ritual initiations. There's a lot of ideas to be picked up there, but I think generally it worked about as well as you might expect from meeting a few OTO types (ie not).
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Replying to @St_Rev @Meaningness
fascinating! What's an OTO type? I imagine that many kinds of esoteric traditions do that kind of work - perhaps especially embodied ones? I would certainly worry that amoralistic approaches and people lend themselves to metarationality more easily.
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perhaps psychopaths and amoral/immoral/manipulative approaches have a an advantage - it could certainly be argued that that those with selfish and anti-social views are more effective manipulators individually and at scale because they are in some sense meta-rational
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. Banned in Sweden. SubGenius, Zhuangist, white-hat troll. Defrocked mathematician. Brain problems.