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RichFelker's profile
Rich Felker
Rich Felker
Rich Felker
@RichFelker

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Rich Felker

@RichFelker

Yeah, I do @musllibc, FOSS & infosec stuff. But now is not the time for a mostly-/only-tech Twitter feed.

musl-libc.org
Joined March 2014

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    1. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz @RichFelker

      The way the IDE does it makes sense, but they're assuming you're going to end up needing the full flexibility needed by apps with millions of lines of code, multiple build variants, multiple apks built together, etc. That's why it's deeper than what a person would do by hand.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz @RichFelker

      https://github.com/copperhead/Hello … is what the IDE generates when asking for minSdkVersion 23, AppCompat enabled and an empty activity with an layout. Empty project doesn't start with a code or layout (might not be making an application with a GUI). It's over-engineered for most projects.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz @RichFelker

      IDE also runs `gradle wrapper` by default, which adds this: https://github.com/copperhead/Hello/tree/gradlew …. Completely optional just like their choice to add the app/ directory with settings.gradle instead of having that as the top-level project.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz @RichFelker

      Choice to have src/{androidTest,main,test} is also another subjective decision. https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Android … is an example of having a single top-level build.gradle with src/ and res/ there instead of this app/src/main nesting. IDE isn't necessarily helpful for making a project.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    5. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz @RichFelker

      Also worth noting that the apps inside AOSP do not approach it like this. Can drop a trivial build.gradle into a project like https://android.googlesource.com/platform/packages/apps/ExactCalculator/+/android-8.1.0_r20 … and build it outside AOSP. IDE itself can also still handle a project structured like Signal perfectly fine.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz @RichFelker

      It's subjective if you want to set minSdkVersion, targetSdkVersion, etc. in build.gradle or AndroidManifest.xml too. Don't necessarily need to use gradle at all. AOSP doesn't build anything with it, and some companies (even some Google projects) use other build systems. *shrug*

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz

      I'd obviously use make if I knew how to invoke the relevant commands.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @RichFelker @Michcioperz

      Well it might make sense to use https://docs.bazel.build/versions/master/tutorial/android-app.html … if you don't really care about doing things the usual way. AOSP uses make, but they moved to compiling mk -> ninja with Kati for fast incremental builds and are slowly moving to a declarative build system.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz

      Not clear why I'd prefer bazel to make. Make gives fast incremental builds unless you intentionally misuse it.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
      Replying to @RichFelker @Michcioperz

      The reason would be that they already wrote all the handling for Android support and they have an IDE plugin so if you ever wanted to open the project in the IDE for static analysis, etc. you could. It also wouldn't drive other contributors away as much.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Rich Felker‏ @RichFelker Apr 8
      Replying to @CopperheadOS @Michcioperz

      From my perspective (ppl I work with), bazel would drive them away a lot more than make.

      10:10 AM - 8 Apr 2018
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          AOSP still primarily uses make but it's not really intended for external projects. They moved to their own implementation of make on top of ninja for better incremental build performance but it still works with GNU make.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @CopperheadOS @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          They're slowly moving away from using make but not for performance reasons anymore (https://github.com/google/kati  solved those). They treat it make as a declarative build system everywhere but central build code which just includes all of the declarative http://Android.mk  files.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @CopperheadOS @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          Their new build system is essentially just an implementation of their http://Android.mk  templates in a way that enforces they're declarative. It's a little bit faster but the main reason is just avoiding the chance of making mistakes with make somewhere in the source tree.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @CopperheadOS @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          Not sure how hard it would be to do things by hand with make. It would be painful because you would be exposed to the underlying tools changing over time. A year ago, they compiled Java -> dex with jack without javac, but now it's javac for bytecode -> dex compiler.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @CopperheadOS @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          You'd need to manually deal with compiling resources, proguard optimization, bundling it into an apk, signing releases, etc. Tools aren't that hard to use by hand but it would be annoying. If someone wrote an equivalent to AOSP make support for standalone apps it'd be fine.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @CopperheadOS @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          Personally prefer http://Android.mk  (old) / Android.bp (new) over build.gradle and prefer the simpler AOSP style directory structure with src/ and res/ at the top-level. Wouldn't want to lose IDE support despite writing everything in Vim though.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Mark Villacampa‏ @MarkVillacampa Apr 8
          Replying to @CopperheadOS @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          sorry to sneak into the convo, but could you point me to some resource comparing Android build systems over time? Seems like they’ve had a few, even parallel ones...

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        9. CopperheadOS‏ @CopperheadOS Apr 8
          Replying to @MarkVillacampa @RichFelker @Michcioperz

          The Android Open Source Project started with a uniform make-based build system for the entire OS. External projects like SQLite, LLVM, etc. have http://Android.mk  files added to build them in the declarative Android way with a single instance of make for the whole OS.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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