Note that for humans this translates to us being able to learn, for instance, to like spicy food, or that doing work on the sabbath is bad, if these tend to lead to rewards (not eating moldy food, social inclusion).
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But this is altering the subjective, pleasures (what’s tasty), not the objective, end state that determines the pleasures (static healthy). And the former isn’t altered Willy-nill, but only due to its predicted correspondence w/ the latter.
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That is the objective end state is fixed, the stuff that evolved to act as goals. The subjective pleasures r not. But they cannot be “chosen.” They r not controlled by focused thought. They r controlled by actual predicted/learned associations.
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Replying to @Moshe_Hoffman @DeltrusGaming
We can learn to change the associations, and the cortical content the rewards are associated with, and the relationship between that content and sensory data, and perhaps most importantly the expected reward in a given situation (which is what is actually driving our actions).
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Replying to @Plinz @DeltrusGaming
If by change the associations u mean actually legitimately find real associations, then yes, people are good at doing that, and that’s exactly what we were designed to do. That doesn’t seem like a hack but a design feature. If u mean feign an association...
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Replying to @Moshe_Hoffman @DeltrusGaming
We probably generate most of the basic reward signals in the limbic system, and they are associated through reinforcement learning with representations of situations and actions in the neocortex. We can modulate these associations, and the neocortex is fully up for grabs anyway.
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This is not theoretic or hypothetical. Buddhist sutra training reduces anticipated reward and downregulates associations with actual rewards, tantra messes with how to get how much reward, Zen changes your model of what is actually going on, and Kundalini is full-on wireheading.
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Replying to @Plinz @DeltrusGaming
Yeah, I concur w/ the empirical phenomena. Just puzzled by it on theoretical grounds. And positing that maybe it ain’t hacking our reward system but works bc it actually helps us attain rewards, Eg by organizing our thoughts/helping us relax?
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Replying to @Moshe_Hoffman @DeltrusGaming
It definitely helps the monks feel better, but I also notice that they don't seem to have a lot of offspring :)
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Replying to @Plinz @DeltrusGaming
Evolved rewards isn’t the same as evolutionary fitness. It’s the shit that we evolved to pursue. Status, sex, food, etc. Which tended to yield fitness, by its pursuit. But need not today yield fitness.
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Exactly. Here is where I explored that argument last summer:https://youtu.be/xqetKitv1Ko?t=17m45s …
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