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@Pinboard

The light inside is broken, but I still work. The Cadillac of online bookmarking sites. Alleged nocoiner. http://pinboard.in  maciej@ceglowski.com +1 415 610 0231

Lonely street of broken dreams
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    1. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard May 29
      Replying to @matthew_d_green

      I'm not a "give up before trying" person, so I think the first good step is investigation, even if the Chinese government offers no assistance. And rewarding their bullying tactics on this or any other point is counterproductive.

      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
    2. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green May 29
      Replying to @Pinboard

      Let’s assume for the sake of argument that this was an accidental lab leak. Let’s also assume the CCP knows this. I’m thinking they’re *strongly* incentivized to prevent future leaks. What they won’t accept is any strategy that threatens hold them responsible for COVID.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    3. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green May 29
      Replying to @matthew_d_green @Pinboard

      So at a certain point you have to ask what it is you really want. Do you want international lab safety controls? Or do you want to try to find the truth, even if the cost is that you get neither truth nor lab safety controls.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    4. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard May 29
      Replying to @matthew_d_green

      The question under that hypothetical would not be making sure China brings itself up to some putatively safe international norms, but questioning those norms themselves, and cutting off whole fields of research globally as too dangerous to conduct.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard May 29
      Replying to @Pinboard @matthew_d_green

      It does us no good for the next pandemic if China identifies the source of covid in research programs or lab practices that remain routine in 50 other countries, and silently clamps down. That's why the details of what happened in such a scenario matter.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green May 29
      Replying to @Pinboard

      Yes and if I thought there was even a 1% chance that China would ever allow us to collect those details I’d be on your side.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    7. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard May 29
      Replying to @matthew_d_green

      They do collect an awful lot of information, and the inherent derpiness of authoritarian states (combined with brave individuals) makes me more hopeful than you that we'll find out more.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green May 29
      Replying to @Pinboard

      Alternatively: since much of the existing case in favor of a lab leak is *that we know certain research is risky and can cause lab leaks* maybe we should just accept that it may or may not have happened here — and work together to make sure it doesn’t happen (again) in the future

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    9. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard May 29
      Replying to @matthew_d_green

      This is the "regardless of what caused the plane crash, let's focus on aviation safety" approach, and it's hard to argue with.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    10. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green May 29
      Replying to @Pinboard

      It’s more of a “do we focus on helping the USSR put out the fires at Chernobyl or do we turn it into an opportunity to embarrass them” moment.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
      Pinboard‏ @Pinboard May 29
      Replying to @matthew_d_green

      This is more like we're asking the USSR to help us understand the source of the radioactive plume over Europe.

      12:40 PM - 29 May 2021
      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        1. Matthew Green‏Verified account @matthew_d_green May 29
          Replying to @Pinboard

          If you, like the rest of us, spent the pandemic watching and reading about Chernobyl, you’ll recall that the Politburo was strongly in favor of denying that there was a plume, and didn’t want to ask for Western help. China just doesn’t have a Gorbachev here.

          0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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