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@Pinboard

The light inside is broken, but I still work. The Cadillac of online bookmarking sites. Alleged nocoiner. http://pinboard.in  maciej@ceglowski.com +1 415 610 0231

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    1. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 22 Apr 2020

      Forgive me if this is a cold question; I genuinely want to understand the answer. Isn't a 90% death rate of coronavirus patients on ventilators somewhat in tension with the message that we have to do everything in our power to flatten the curve so we don't run out of ventilators?

      48 replies 7 retweets 92 likes
      Show this thread
    2. noahlz‏ @noahlz 22 Apr 2020
      Replying to @Pinboard

      No ventilator = 100% death rate, no? Imagine you're a healthcare worker telling a family you had choose who got that ventilator, and sorry but their 58 yro father already had diabetes, so they gave it to someone younger.

      1 reply 1 retweet 10 likes
      Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 22 Apr 2020
      Replying to @noahlz

      That same logic holds for 10% death rate and 99% death rate, though. The issue here is that slowing the spread to stay within ventilator capacity is a tradeoff, not an unalloyed good.

      8:43 PM - 22 Apr 2020
      • 4 Likes
      • Rajiv Sinclair Karl Cuppazucchini They're amendments not commandments. 🌹 Skeevy Wonder
      3 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. noahlz‏ @noahlz 22 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard

          My understanding was that doctors don't want to be in a scenario where they are actually deciding who lives, who dies. Something that has happened in Italy for example...

          2 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
        3. noahlz‏ @noahlz 22 Apr 2020
          Replying to @noahlz @Pinboard

          So yes, I think it's mostly about optics but also there's the point that they'd rather everyone have that 10% chance.

          0 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
        4. End of conversation
        1. Mangy Jay‏ @magi_jay 22 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard @noahlz

          I don't understand the purpose of this point. We already know that social distancing is a trade-off that has negative social and economic consequences. This has been known from the beginning. Also, again, it's not just about ventilator capacity.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. Convolver‏ @Convolver 22 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard @noahlz

          ICU beds, providers per patient, HFNC circuits, dialysis machines, pharmaceuticals … there’s a lot of personnel, beds, hardware, and consumables that would get overwhelmed. Standards of care appear to have evolved to intubate later and as a last resort, but the principle holds.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Fred Barrett‏ @fkbarrett 22 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Convolver @Pinboard @noahlz

          Exactly, from what I understand it was never *just* about ventilators.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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