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@Pinboard

The light inside is broken, but I still work. The Cadillac of online bookmarking sites. Alleged nocoiner. http://pinboard.in  maciej@ceglowski.com +1 415 610 0231

Lonely street of broken dreams
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    1. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      The technical argument against contact tracing right now is that the resolution of these devices is not sufficient to figure out contact history. The phone knows you are at South Station, but not who you passed within six feet of. So it's useless, right?

      1 reply 2 retweets 13 likes
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    2. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      But the point is we can use this data IN CONJUNCTION with all other methods, and we can use it to reduce the search space so that other, more labor intensive methods (like interviews) can be brought to bear. We also live in a surveillance society with things like camera footage

      2 replies 1 retweet 18 likes
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    3. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      The correct way to look at this technical capability is not as a magic surveillance solution that replaces the hard work of contact tracing, but an additional tool, *already deployed at scale internationally*, that we can put in the hands of epidemiologists and doctors

      1 reply 5 retweets 19 likes
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    4. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      In particular, phone based contact tracing can retroactively answer vital questions like "did anyone who attended this party that was a spreading event then fly to another city? Where did they go while infectious?" https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/23/us/coronavirus-westport-connecticut-party-zero.html …

      1 reply 3 retweets 9 likes
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    5. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      It doesn't matter that your phone doesn't give pinpoint location data. The rough location data may already be enough to help investigators cut the possible number of contacts from tens of thousands to hundreds. And that is the kind of capability we need as we move to containment

      2 replies 2 retweets 11 likes
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    6. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      Note that *in particular* this implies that measures that just do contact tracing, while trying to keep location ambiguous or undetermined, are not sufficient. We need the maximum resolution data these devices are already broadcasting to advertisers, platform owners, the GRU, etc

      1 reply 1 retweet 8 likes
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    7. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      The more general problem with privacy advocates' arguments against technical measures is that they are not being made in good faith. They have a desired conclusion ("this doesn't even work!") based on their policy preferences, and they fit their thinking to meet it.

      2 replies 3 retweets 18 likes
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    8. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      I'd be very curious to hear from people in the epidemiological world whether a data stream that let them track long-distance travel by infected people, and generate a list of potential contacts based on even rough proximity data, would be useful in containing this disease

      4 replies 2 retweets 6 likes
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    9. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      There are all sorts of privacy arguments you can make for why we shouldn't do this kind of contact tracing. I'll fight you, but they're strong arguments! The technical arguments, however, are weaksauce. Anything that helps prune a list of potential contacts is better than nothing

      2 replies 3 retweets 16 likes
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    10. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      A final point needs emphasis. The debate isn't how we use these technologies right now. There is no point to doing that until we've reached a state like Taiwan or South Korea, where it's back to tracking individual cases, and want to reopen the economy and resume normalish life

      1 reply 2 retweets 12 likes
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      Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 8 Apr 2020

      The upshot is this: for the first time in human history, we have a working, automated real-time and retroactive location tracking tool for something like 80% of the US population. Do we make it part of our pandemic response, or strictly limit it to data brokers and advertisers?

      11:30 PM - 8 Apr 2020
      • 17 Retweets
      • 52 Likes
      • Scott Francis ن (vaxxed && chillaxed) Eric Zeng Sam Fenster Alon Zakai Benjamin Ortega tylernol Chris Chelberg Tom Yemm Matthieu VM
      5 replies 17 retweets 52 likes
        1. cgp‏ @_cgp 8 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard

          You have to appreciate the argument: we’ve failed to protect people, why even try?

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        2. Jeff Atwood‏Verified account @codinghorror 8 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard

          I feel like there is sooooo much lower hanging fruit on this particular tree. masks. hand washing. testing. a social norm for not talking in crowded spaces, apparently.

          1 reply 1 retweet 10 likes
        3. Jeff Atwood‏Verified account @codinghorror 8 Apr 2020
          Replying to @codinghorror @Pinboard

          plus, don't we know now that people with zero symptoms can transmit CV-19? So how exactly does that help this whole "track all the peoples all the time" scenario? Versus masks? hand washing? testing?https://www.livescience.com/coronavirus-asymptomatic-spread.html …

          1 reply 1 retweet 1 like
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        1. the bird celebrator‏ @davezacuto 8 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard

          [neoliberalism twirls its moustache in response]

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Supamanô 🌞 😎 🌝‏ @supamano84 9 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard

          Google, FB, and all these big data should make their data available for free to a consortium of vetted, ethical scientists

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. James Brown‏ @Roguelazer 9 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Pinboard

          I think that 80% is interesting; I would guess that the most tracked ppl live in poverty & use Android phones full of spyware and the least are wealthy iOS users who have location svcs disabled and only have tower triangulation. How does it affect results to only track the poor?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 9 Apr 2020
          Replying to @Roguelazer

          You think 80% of the population is poor?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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