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The light inside is broken, but I still work. The Cadillac of online bookmarking sites. Alleged nocoiner. http://pinboard.in  maciej@ceglowski.com +1 415 610 0231

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    1. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 2 Aug 2019

      Here's a question that's been intriguing me a while. What would be the harms of a ban on end-to-end encryption in mass-market products? People feel safe using Gmail and Telegram routinely for sensitive stuff. What argument do you have for E2E for civilians that really resonates?

      51 replies 15 retweets 57 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 2 Aug 2019

      I ask because I think the rhetoric on the "allow exceptional access to law enforcement" side of the debate is far better, and I'm curious what that nerd herd can bring to bear here rhetorically. (Remember on substance I am a true believer, don't burn me on sharpened stake etc.)

      20 replies 1 retweet 27 likes
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    3. Bram De Buyser‏ @chton 2 Aug 2019
      Replying to @Pinboard

      Practical impossiblities of a backdoor aside, one of the problems is one of the primary reasons you'd want end-to-end encryption is when your government turns fascist and you want to talk without them reading it. Exactly the scenario a backdoor would make impossible.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      Pinboard‏ @Pinboard 2 Aug 2019
      Replying to @chton

      How is a backdoor impossible? Here's how I would do it: ban the distribution of chat apps without lawful access to law enforcement. You'd get backdoors the day after the law went into effect.

      12:12 PM - 2 Aug 2019
      • 2 Likes
      • $MIGUEL Piedrafita 🌟 Jeff Atwood
      4 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Bram De Buyser‏ @chton 2 Aug 2019
          Replying to @Pinboard

          Then you don't have end to end encryption. End to end means only my device and yours have the keys to decrypt the messages i send to you. No in between service can read it.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Bram De Buyser‏ @chton 2 Aug 2019
          Replying to @chton @Pinboard

          The only way to make a backdoor work in that scenario is either register the keys somewhere centrally, which becomes a massive security hole; or use a broken encryption algorithm, which completely breaks the point.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. Jeff Atwood‏Verified account @codinghorror 2 Aug 2019
          Replying to @Pinboard @chton

          apps, maybe, but how do you ban *all websites* when a website could implement the same protocols? Just open a browser to bypass that law

          3 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
        3. Jeff Atwood‏Verified account @codinghorror 2 Aug 2019
          Replying to @codinghorror @Pinboard @chton

          note that whatsapp would have the same network in a browser that they do in an app. It would arguably stunt future growth somewhat, but other than that, same service, same network effects

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation
        1. Nicholas Ptacek‏ @nptacek 2 Aug 2019
          Replying to @Pinboard @chton

          How do you ban the distribution of non-compliant chat apps when sideloading is a thing? For that matter, how do you stop hidden encrypted chat functionality in non-chat apps? Remember Apple playing whack-a-mole w/apps that provided hidden wifi tethering functionality? Won’t work.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        1. Javi‏ @javver 2 Aug 2019
          Replying to @Pinboard @chton

          The backdoor itself is possible but if a master key exists it will never be controllable and makes forward secrecy useless.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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