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PhilosophyExp's profile
Jeremy Stangroom
Jeremy Stangroom
Jeremy Stangroom
@PhilosophyExp

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Jeremy Stangroom

@PhilosophyExp

I didn't get to where I am today - nowhere, obviously - by tweeting.

Toronto, Canada
philosophyexperiments.com
Joined March 2010

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    1. Alice Sullivan‏ @ProfAliceS Jul 15
      • Report Tweet

      Where does the slogan “no debate” come from? Does anyone know when it was first used and how it caught on? And is it completely unprecedented for a new social movement to demand acquiescence without argument, or has anyone tried this before?

      4 replies 8 retweets 28 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Colin Mills‏ @OxSoc Jul 15
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @ProfAliceS

      I remember it on campus from late 70s early 80s & associate it with the Anti-Nazi League / SWP. Usually in connection with keeping campus clear of National Front & other boot-boy types.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Alice Sullivan‏ @ProfAliceS Jul 15
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      Replying to @OxSoc

      I see no-platforming groups who are actually violent (as opposed to ‘literally violent’) as quite different though.

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    4. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 15
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

      John Carlisle (Tory MP) was often deplatformed in early-1980s, because of links to South Africa. Barclays Bank also ran into difficulties with student unions.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    5. Holly Smith‏ @hollysmithhere Jul 16
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      Replying to @PhilosophyExp @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

      Barclays Bank apartheid SA action was a boycott, like divestment or sanctions absolutely not associated with 'no debate' or unwillingless to engage. Boycott often associated with turning up to shareholder meetings and AGMs to make the case, also letter writing, so all for debate!

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
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      Replying to @hollysmithhere @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

      I'm almost certain that I sat in Student Union meetings at Southampton University where students shut down Tory MPs who had links to Barclays Bank. Certainly John Carlisle was unable to speak. Dangers of reconstructed memory, of course.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Holly Smith‏ @hollysmithhere Jul 16
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      Replying to @PhilosophyExp @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

      I believe you, but I think boycott, which is primarily an economic tactic, feels quite different to 'no debate' which I genuinely can't think of any precedent for. Disputes over , for eg abortion rights and Palestine solidarity, have been incredibly bitter, but very much debated.

      3 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Holly Smith‏ @hollysmithhere Jul 16
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      Replying to @hollysmithhere @PhilosophyExp and

      Yes my impression / recollection is that the debate about race and IQ was won fair and square the old fashioned way, with reason and evidence. With special mention to Stephen Jay Gould for 'The Mismeasure of Man' but clear Wilson and Gould were absolutely in academic debate.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
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      Replying to @hollysmithhere @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

      Well, Wilson & Gould were in an academic debate, but Wilson told me he had protestors in his lectures for a time after the controversy arose. So I think it was a mixed picture, but agree not systematic as today.

      10:24 AM - 16 Jul 2019
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. Holly Smith‏ @hollysmithhere Jul 16
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          Replying to @PhilosophyExp @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

          Well throwing cold water over him described in Wikipedia link above, well out of order! But the same Wikipedia entry describes Gould and Wilson being part of the same research group and Gould condemning such attacks. So not violating foundational HE values of reason and argument.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
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          Replying to @hollysmithhere @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

          I lunched with him at Harvard once (I interviewed him for a book I did), so I chatted with him about this stuff. Things were very uncomfortable for him for a while. My view is that the shenanigans were certainly on the edge of violating foundational values of reason & argument.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @PhilosophyExp @hollysmithhere and

          So, for example, the American Anthropological Association debated a motion to censure Sociobiology on the grounds that it was an attempt to justify the elitist, sexist and racist status quo (it clearly wasn't that - most of it wasn't about humans at all!).

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
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          Replying to @PhilosophyExp @hollysmithhere and

          Gould & Lewontin talked about gas chambers when discussing Sociobiology. Okay, they didn't quite say that Wilson was justifying gas chambers, but even so.... Time magazine at the time stated that the reaction to Wilson was a bit like the denunciation of Galileo.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @PhilosophyExp @hollysmithhere and

          For what it's worth (which isn't much), I interviewed him a couple of times (for 2 books, What Philosophers Think & What Scientists Think), and wrote about this stuff in Why Truth Matters (which I authored with Ophelia Benson). There's much more detail there.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        7. Holly Smith‏ @hollysmithhere Jul 16
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          Replying to @PhilosophyExp @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

          Thanks for sharing the book references, I'm sorry I didn't realise your experience was rather more first hand than mine!

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Jeremy Stangroom‏ @PhilosophyExp Jul 16
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @hollysmithhere @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

          No apology necessary at all. Plus, to be honest, my first hand experience probably means I'm biased in Wilson's favor. He was extremely kind and charming (he'd bought me sandwiches & a coke on his way into Harvard, that sort of thing).

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        9. Holly Smith‏ @hollysmithhere Jul 16
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @PhilosophyExp @ProfAliceS @OxSoc

          I'm firmly on the Gould side, but I think we can agree throwing things at professors is absolutely unacceptable. Suggests a lack of confidence of the hurlers in their capacity to make convincing arguments to the contrary. I'm sure I'm often wrong, but ready to engage and learn.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
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