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NickSzabo4's profile
Nick Szabo 🔑
Nick Szabo 🔑
Nick Szabo  🔑
@NickSzabo4

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Nick Szabo  🔑

@NickSzabo4

Blockchain, cryptocurrency, and smart contracts pioneer. (RT/Fav/Follow does not imply endorsement). Blog: http://unenumerated.blogspot.com 

Joined June 2014

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    Two-way (sending and receiving) short codes:

    Country Code For customers of
    United States 40404 (any)
    Canada 21212 (any)
    United Kingdom 86444 Vodafone, Orange, 3, O2
    Brazil 40404 Nextel, TIM
    Haiti 40404 Digicel, Voila
    Ireland 51210 Vodafone, O2
    India 53000 Bharti Airtel, Videocon, Reliance
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    1. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @peterktodd @ChrisBlec and

      I suspect AT&T (and others) don't do that because it'd be bad marketing to say "Hey! You're phone #'s aren't secure!" Petzl seems to have gotten over that problem, and is quite happy to warn you how you can kill yourself with their products.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    2. Nick Szabo  🔑‏ @NickSzabo4 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @peterktodd @ChrisBlec @TuurDemeester

      It would go way over the heads of the vast majority of their customers, and even of most security professionals, and even of themselves, to try to describe in any reasonably complete fashion what phone numbers are and are not secure for.

      3 replies 1 retweet 11 likes
    3. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @NickSzabo4 @ChrisBlec @TuurDemeester

      You're making this ridiculously complex. Lots of people are hurt by phones getting hijacking, with lots of well known cases. AT&T is aware of this. It's *very* easy to say "Hey! This is obviously bad, stop doing it" If this were a rarely encountered hazard I'd think otherwise.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    4. Ivan Brightly‏ @ibrightly 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @peterktodd @NickSzabo4 and

      How can ATT legally stop someone from porting their number to another carrier? They legally cannot block the port because of a forgotten password and it’s not very hard for somone to physically show up with forged ID.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    5. Ivan Brightly‏ @ibrightly 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @ibrightly @peterktodd and

      Even if carriers could make it *more* secure I still cannot see security professionals recommending relying on carrier level security for banking level requirements.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @ibrightly @NickSzabo4 and

      Then take some basic measures to discourage 2FA like customer education and talking to major 2FA users! It's ok if they don't want to provide this service, but given the level of harm they have to put some effort into discouraging that.

      2 replies 0 retweets 4 likes
    7. Nick Szabo  🔑‏ @NickSzabo4 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @peterktodd @ibrightly and

      They may've found phone numbers useful & benign (though it is very much not their expertise or business) in the reversible banking txs they are familiar with, but haven't studied consequences of use w/irreversible crypto. Ridiculous to expect them rather than Coinbase to do that.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    8. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @NickSzabo4 @ibrightly and

      They don't have to study this issue. They simply have to observe the obvious fact that lots of people are getting hurt in this way. That requires no special knowledge. And after all, this is an issue that extends to more than just cryptocurrency: e.g. stolen gmail accounts.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    9. Nick Szabo  🔑‏ @NickSzabo4 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @peterktodd @ibrightly and

      It's not at all obvious to them. They are in a completely different business and they don't keep track of vast majority of stats in the dizzying variety of other businesses including ours. Even experts in our own industry don't keep good track of these novel risks and losses.

      1 reply 1 retweet 4 likes
    10. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @NickSzabo4 @ibrightly and

      Lol, that's just silly. A company the size of AT&T can figure that out by just reading the popular technical press, and listening to their customer's complaints. You're just making excuses at this point; that's not even remotely a valid argument.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      Nick Szabo  🔑‏ @NickSzabo4 15 Aug 2018
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @peterktodd @ibrightly and

      Regardless of their size, they don't read stuff like Bitcoin Magazine et. al that is extremely far outside their business of providing phone service, and you can't seriously expect them to have learned this kind of thing from common mainstream media.

      9:28 PM - 15 Aug 2018
      • 1 Retweet
      • 2 Likes
      • AfriCrypto Spooky "Merchant" John
      2 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @NickSzabo4 @ibrightly and

          This stuff has had plenty of coverage in very mainstream tech media: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/05/thieves-drain-2fa-protected-bank-accounts-by-abusing-ss7-routing-protocol/ … Again, that's a ridiculous argument.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        3. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @peterktodd @NickSzabo4 and

          ...and we *know* they're aware of these problems, because phone companies offer services like account PINs to prevent them!

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Nick Szabo  🔑‏ @NickSzabo4 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @peterktodd @ibrightly and

          That only prevents a proper subset of the problems, of which they probably actually know only about a small fraction. It doesn't imply they have a solution or even know about the dizzying variety of other possible problems.

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        5. Raz‏ @suprraz 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @NickSzabo4 @peterktodd and

          AT&T should be liable for $100-$10000 worth: a multiple of the money they are in contract for. Then, they could be expected to commit a percentage of that money towards security and insurance. It won't cover millions of accounts for $200,000,000 each, but maybe $1000.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Nick Szabo  🔑‏ @NickSzabo4 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @suprraz @peterktodd and

          Or you could actually let liability be defined by the contract and by the kind of product they offer. If people really want the phone companies to provide "identity" services for them, they should convince phone companies to provide such services and pay for them.

          0 replies 0 retweets 7 likes
        7. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. 情報下水道・ツ 🍙‏ @MWSnacky 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @NickSzabo4 @peterktodd and

          How come nobody is blaming the sites that allow phone based 2FA (Google, exchanges), aren't they the ones encouraging irresponsible behavior? "Secure your account with this" The phone service is merely a platform; I.e. If you store your keys on evernote it's not evernote's fault

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Peter Todd‏ @peterktodd 15 Aug 2018
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @MWSnacky @BTCSnacky and

          I've said elsewhere in this thread that I also blame those exchanges, Coinbase in this case. To be clear, I think Coinbase should shoulder most of the responsibility here, with AT&T a minority part. That'd be socially useful too, as it'd reduce "race to the bottom" UX pressure.

          0 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
        4. End of conversation

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