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Ngnghm's profile
💻🐴Ngnghm
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@Ngnghm

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@Ngnghm

Welcome to the Swiftian World of Houyhnhnm Computing ("Hunam"). I am @fare's software alter ego (but see @phanaero for cryptofoo). Call me "Ann". 🐎Read my blog!

Lair of the French Resistance
ngnghm.github.io
Joined August 2015

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    1. Stephen Pimentel‏ @StephenPiment 22 Feb 2019
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      Stephen Pimentel Retweeted David Chapman

      Commercialization of Lisp machines was attempted and definitively failed. "Worse is Better" is one attempt to explain why. It's an instance of a fascinating phenomenon, but not of overall decline (although the latter may independently be true). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worse_is_better …https://twitter.com/Meaningness/status/1098826438415794176 …

      Stephen Pimentel added,

      David Chapman @Meaningness
      Finding my way around PyCharm, apparently the premier python IDE, and noting once again that the MIT Lispm dev environment I used in 1979 was still superior to anything available today. #CivilizationalDecay pic.twitter.com/bCn8JxzfJU
      1 reply 3 retweets 8 likes
    2. Perry E. Metzger‏ @perrymetzger 22 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @StephenPiment

      I don't think "Worse is Better" really explains it. The LispM builders made a number of serious mistakes. For example, the IBM 801 papers had already been published at the point where they were designing the CADR but they didn't pay attention to them, and continued not to.

      2 replies 1 retweet 5 likes
    3. Perry E. Metzger‏ @perrymetzger 22 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @perrymetzger @StephenPiment

      (They presumed that microcoded architectures with complicated instructions were better, and never tried measuring to prove what was in fact a hypothesis. The hypothesis was, of course, desperately wrong.)

      2 replies 0 retweets 8 likes
    4. Perry E. Metzger‏ @perrymetzger 22 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @perrymetzger @StephenPiment

      They also presumed that portability wasn't really important, that tying software hand and foot to a particular CPU architecture was fine. That I can blame them for less; the first really portable OS (Unix) already existed but wasn't widely understood yet.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    5. Alfred M. Szmidt‏ @amszmidt 24 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @perrymetzger @StephenPiment

      This isn’t really true, the #Lisp #Machine software was ported to multiple architectures that are vastly different. MIT CADR, LMI LAMBDA, Symbolics G-machines,TI Explorer. And not to mention that the majority of the system was a variant of MACLISP.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Perry E. Metzger‏ @perrymetzger 24 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @amszmidt @StephenPiment

      To a limited extent; it's not the easy problem you have with porting Unix. The CADR family required hardware assists for things like garbage collection and type checking.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Alfred M. Szmidt‏ @amszmidt 24 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @perrymetzger @StephenPiment

      Eh? The CADR architecture has nothing todo with how GC occurs on the #lisp #machine.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Alfred M. Szmidt‏ @amszmidt 24 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @amszmidt @perrymetzger @StephenPiment

      The CADR has no concept of type checking, all of that is done on a #lisp #machine system level. I.e. bunch of microcode that does the task when executing macro code (what you might call Lisp). But the CADR... it’s a simple RISCy CPU.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Perry E. Metzger‏ @perrymetzger 24 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @amszmidt @StephenPiment

      Microcode is implemented in what? System software? No, it's implemented in hardware. The whole system depended on using complicated microcode left and right. It was a bad idea. There's a reason no one builds stuff that way now.

      3 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
       💻 🐴Ngnghm‏ @Ngnghm 24 Feb 2019
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      Replying to @perrymetzger @amszmidt @StephenPiment

      Microcode made plenty of sense in a time when logic circuitry was expensive and no faster than memory. It makes less sense today with much larger processors much faster than memory. Don't judge the ideas of your forefathers by the standards of today's technology.

      5:51 PM - 24 Feb 2019
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. Alfred M. Szmidt‏ @amszmidt 24 Feb 2019
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          Replying to @Ngnghm @perrymetzger @StephenPiment

          Well, vendors seem to think it still makes sense — X86 being case in point. :-)

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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