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NegarestaniReza's profile
Reza Negarestani
Reza Negarestani
Reza Negarestani
@NegarestaniReza

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Reza Negarestani

@NegarestaniReza

Creator of a blunt object known as Intelligence and Spirit https://tinyurl.com/s7e226j  (Urbanomic/Sequence).

CT
toyphilosophy.com
Joined December 2019

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    1. Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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      Replying to @NegarestaniReza @lesoiseauxdumal

      and disvalues as Findlay had it is a fruit of an ongoing labor, the modal, counterfactual and constructive elements of a logic that precede morality. It is what is called Ethics.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    2. Malbird‏ @lesoiseauxdumal Feb 3
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      Replying to @NegarestaniReza

      sure. but I think this is not about ethics vs. morality. bear with me here cause as I said, I dunno much about this. let's say Morality is an attribute of a system that tries to dominate/survive-amidst other systems that restrain it.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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      Replying to @lesoiseauxdumal

      One of the greatest lessons of Plato was to distinguish phases from nomos. Phusis is concerned with norms which are objective, noms on the other hand are more like social conventions and etiquettes.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    4. Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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      Replying to @NegarestaniReza @lesoiseauxdumal

      So imagine if we could shelter ourselves by making houses, the codes of building could serve the objective needs or conventions. How can it be of the former instead of the latter?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    5. Malbird‏ @lesoiseauxdumal Feb 3
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      Replying to @NegarestaniReza

      in some phases, the objective needs and conventions overlap (how could they not? I think of convention as a 3rd-degree abstraction. the development of Money can be thought of here). i.e an objective code-to-build can turn into a convention (stratification?) during n generation.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Malbird‏ @lesoiseauxdumal Feb 3
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      Replying to @lesoiseauxdumal @NegarestaniReza

      maybe a turn toward rationalism would be to always objectivize (!) all moral codes into an Espinoza-esque economy of usefulness/hindrance. isn't that "deterritorialization" in so many words then? anyways, I cannot see how Land is being inconsistent. I get your point though.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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      Replying to @lesoiseauxdumal

      Yes this is essentially Plato cutting at the joints. Yes they can overlap but are they the same. The objective requirements are always there. But the conventions can change for the better or the worse.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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      Replying to @NegarestaniReza @lesoiseauxdumal

      Imagine a builder guild who suddenly says that no one should make beams from this kind of material but only from the material that the guild approves. This is when you should pit the objective rules a la phusis against whimsical conventions so as to subvert the latter.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Malbird‏ @lesoiseauxdumal Feb 3
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      Replying to @NegarestaniReza

      Yes YES. that was my original point about the malignant super-intelligence which can only develop against the elite (the guild).

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Malbird‏ @lesoiseauxdumal Feb 3
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      Replying to @lesoiseauxdumal @NegarestaniReza

      let's say a super AI reads the ratio of energy-consuming against the possibility of breaking the earth-egg and "going into space", and concludes that 75% of existing fossil industries should be subverted in order for the egg to hold. that would be his malignant Super-folan.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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      Replying to @lesoiseauxdumal

      That would be just a reward-driven agent, not a fully transcendental one. Transcendence is very much like buying a dell laptop, it comes with a lot junks. If you try to delete them, you machines goes kaput.

      12:11 PM - 3 Feb 2020
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Malbird‏ @lesoiseauxdumal Feb 3
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          Replying to @NegarestaniReza

          that I don't understand. I cannot see a non-reward-driven AI. I guess I should read Intelligence and Spirit to get enlighted, hm?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Reza Negarestani‏ @NegarestaniReza Feb 3
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          Replying to @lesoiseauxdumal

          Reward is a vague concept just like pain or pleasure as Turing undersood it. These concepts are a matter of education. The kind of reward Seneca has in mind after freeing a slave is far different in nature than the reward an Amoeba expects after adopting to a warm water.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. End of conversation

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