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NGrossman81's profile
Nicholas Grossman
Nicholas Grossman
Nicholas Grossman
@NGrossman81

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Nicholas Grossman

@NGrossman81

International Relations prof at U. Illinois. Senior Editor @ArcDigi. Author “Drones and Terrorism.” Politics, national security, and occasional nerdery.

amazon.com/Drones-Terrori…
Joined April 2015

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    1. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28

      Nicholas Grossman Retweeted Tomás Sidenfaden

      Interesting question. Worth exploring. 1) Dick's choosing not to carry a certain type of gun doesn't matter, because businesses can choose to sell or not sell any particular product. Doesn't treat anyone unequally.https://twitter.com/tomassidenfaden/status/968905556076281856 …

      Nicholas Grossman added,

      Tomás Sidenfaden @tomassidenfaden
      Dick’s won’t sell firearms to people under 21. It’s legal to buy one at 18. Is this in the same boat as refusing to sell a wedding cake to a gay couple? Curious of the difference here. https://twitter.com/politico/status/968901220420276224 …
      1 reply 5 retweets 6 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28

      2) Not selling cakes to gay couples that the business would sell to straight couples is discrimination based on identity of the customer. Similar to not serving blacks, Jews, Irish, etc. Any variation on "we don't serve your kind here" is wrong because it treats people unequally.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Show this thread
    3. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28

      3) Arguably, not selling firearms to people aged 18-20 is discrimination, because it treats them differently than people aged 21 and older. The difference is everyone 18-20 will become 21 and older, while black people won't become white, gay people won't become straight, etc.

      2 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
      Show this thread
      Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28

      4) And, we typically allow age restrictions on safety grounds, with alcohol the obvious example. You don't have to agree with Dick's decision. But it's different from the wedding cakes case 21+ isn't discriminatory, because age, unlike race or sexual orientation, isn't immutable

      8:23 PM - 28 Feb 2018 from Urbana, IL
      • 7 Likes
      • Jon Birger (((Manny Schewitz))) fluxus monica croft Kay Ornella 🌍🌏🌎 #SaveDemocracy (((Leigh Ann)))
      4 replies 0 retweets 7 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Tomás Sidenfaden‏ @tomassidenfaden Feb 28
          Replying to @NGrossman81

          That reasoning makes sense to me. If mutability is the standard, however, one could argue religion—or religiosity—is also mutable. Seems like a slippery slope.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28
          Replying to @tomassidenfaden

          Religion isn't as clearly immutable as race or sexual orientation--you might be born into it, but you're not "born this way," you can choose to leave--but it's still put in that category as something we should respect as such. I buy that. It's enough of a core aspect of identity.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28
          Replying to @NGrossman81 @tomassidenfaden

          Age is guaranteed to change, so that's clearly not immutable. As for religiosity, that strikes me as a choice. One can change at any time, and much easier than one can abandon a religion for another (or none). Religiosity is a sliding scale, rather than a clear category.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. Dan‏ @BullsLawDan Feb 28
          Replying to @NGrossman81

          It's also not a legally protected class.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28
          Replying to @BullsLawDan

          18-20 year olds? No. But in many states homosexuals are not a legally protected class either.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Dan‏ @BullsLawDan Feb 28
          Replying to @NGrossman81

          True. But in the states where we get these "wedding cake" cases, they are.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        5. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28
          Replying to @BullsLawDan

          Fair enough. Though I took the question as philosophical, rather than legal, and tried to answer it as such.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. End of conversation
        1. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28
          Replying to @misplaced_mic

          Pretty sure refusing service based on behavior is legal. And not just for guns. The customer could file a civil suit, claiming the business was being discriminatory. But whether they win or not would depend on specifics.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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        2. Not Jim Ardis‏ @NotPeoriaMayor Feb 28
          Replying to @NGrossman81

          Except you don't have liquor stores refusing to sell to people that aren't 25 yet. The age limit in that case is mandated by statute.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Nicholas Grossman‏ @NGrossman81 Feb 28
          Replying to @NotPeoriaMayor

          That's true. There's law behind the minimum age for buying alcohol. How about this example: Some comedy clubs, strip clubs, and other venues are 21+, even though their services are legally available to 18-year-olds.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. End of conversation

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