Work is effortful activity that you only do because you are forced to do it to survive. You're arguing that doing things you want to do is no good if you're not also forced to do things you don't want to do?
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Replying to @random_eddie @MorlockP
No, I'm arguing that entropy will always win and you will always have to do work you do not want to do. You can be efficient so that you don't have to do as much, but you're a fool to believe somehow you can get away from it completely.
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With that said - teaching that we shouldn't work is bad for human kind because it's fantasy to say we won't have to. Even the robots that tend to the vats where our future brains are stored aren't guaranteed to run forever.
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Coasting is awesome. We should all enjoy coasting. How do you build up the inertia though? What happens when friction slows you back down? How do cope if you haven't learned how to build up momentum again?
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Replying to @ItsRobbAllen @MorlockP
You're arguing that the ability to do things you have to do but don't want to do ("work") is an important ability. Agreed. And that we will always need to work, and always need to be able to do work. Agreed. That doesn't mean that work is good. It's bad. It should be minimized.
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If we must do work in order to maintain the ability to do work, because we will always need to work, well... that just means that that maintenance is more work. It's bad, but necessary. It should be minimized - as much as possible, but no more.
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But I refuse to participate in the cultural lie that says "human suffering is good" just so that we can delude ourselves (or some of us, anyway) into suffering without complaint because it's "noble". Work is suffering. It's necessary but bad. It should be minimized, not praised.
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Replying to @random_eddie @MorlockP
You define it as suffering. I define it as building momentum. The more efficiently we can build momentum, the better. Complaining we have to do this is the same as cursing the fact we have to breathe.
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Replying to @ItsRobbAllen @MorlockP
I curse the fact that we have to eat. I enjoy eating, but would rather do it on my own terms.
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And yes, This goes back to what I said about sacrifice being noble IF and ONLY IF it's necessary. Work is necessary, so it's noble. Work should be LESS necessary, because it is not INHERENTLY noble.
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Someone has to drag in Moldbug's concept of the "natural aristocracy" - those that work and create value even if not forced to.
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Replying to @MorlockP @ItsRobbAllen
There's another aspect here, which I think we all intuit but haven't said in this thread yet. Effort yields returns. We don't like the effort, so call it "work". But we like the returns. Working now to get something later (in an hour, or a century) is virtuous.
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Nothing In Life Is Free, so we internalize that work is virtuous. But the point I'm making - which doesn't really contradict "working now for rewards later is virtuous" - is that it's not the work which is valuable, but the rewards. Doing less and getting more is good.
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