No; rather, that the caring-about is not meaningfully summarized by “values.” It’s too fine-grained.
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Replying to @Meaningness @everytstudies
Might that depend on the degree of self-awareness of the person talking about their values? I tend to think most, but not all, people talking about their ‘values’ are deceiving themselves and posturing (without conscious intent, I assume), but some seem to get what they’re about.
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Replying to @delysis @everytstudies
Yes, I think that’s right. The construction of a systematic self (in Kegan’s sense) involves bringing activity increasingly in line with explicitly-held values.
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But the shift to stage 5 ethics consists of realizing first that these “values” are empty posturing (which can drop you in stage 4.5 ethical nihilism) and then finding a new ethical sensibility that recovers them as nebulous objects, rather than constitutive of the subject.
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Replying to @Meaningness @delysis
Does "values" imply a systematicity that isn't there?
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Replying to @everytstudies @delysis
That’s my take, yes. The ideal of stage 4 ethics is an axiomatic system in which the correct amount to tip a waiter can be logically derived from a handful of axioms (“values”), via a chain of increasingly specific theorems.
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Replying to @Meaningness @delysis
Huh. I've never considered "values" to be synonymous with a full-blown ethical theory. I care about things, and I call that having values, but I don't have a formal ethical system (because that's silly). Well that's words for ya.
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Replying to @everytstudies @delysis
I care about many things, but most of them no one would call “values.” (Anomalocaridids, for instance.) One would need an account of what makes a caring a value?
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Replying to @Meaningness @delysis
I'd say a caring is a value of you still care about if it doesn't affect you directly. Like the difference between "I don't like broccoli" and "I don't like abortion".
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Replying to @everytstudies @delysis
Anomalocaridids do not affect me directly.
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And, abortion is actually my case in point. There’s strong reasons to believe hardly any one actually cares about it. It’s a tribal shibboleth, not an ethical principle.
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Replying to @Meaningness @delysis
I don't think it's that simple, but I have stuff to do so I have to tap out. Nice chat though
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