A slightly different topic than the one I thought we were discussing, but parallel! In that I'm not sure teaching/learning those rituals is what obstructs spontaneous living meaning! The deprivation has to come first, for a ritual to make sense w/o meaning, or to seem to own it..
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Replying to @Qu137157 @Meaningness
i don't agree any more than your endorphin response has to stop working for exogenous opioids to work, or for them to seem to own the effects they create
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Replying to @chaosprime @Meaningness
I don't think the metaphor is apt, because I don't think the top-down ism's (eternal or nihil) create the effect of meaning's absence; they are at best concomitant, but arguably postcede it. A different account of meaning's loss can be found in:
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the condition of having learnt how to use systems of symbols (procedurally) but not yet having learnt (also procedurally) what they are (and aren't), such that their encounter produces difficulty in, well, just living..
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Replying to @MNV763 @Meaningness
to me, it being possible to rebuild experience of meaning from unmediated experience after tearing out exogenous meaning mechanics, but that some people don't get there because the exogenous meaning mechanics have taken away their permission for that experience, shows otherwise
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Replying to @chaosprime @Meaningness
it's hard to know for sure because nobody alive knows what it would be like to not have had these systems installed with mother's milk, but the rebuilding has the feeling of nurturing a native capacity that was suppressed, not developing a novel one
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Replying to @chaosprime @Meaningness
That "because" seems questionable! Ime the native capacity is to be nurtured, yes, and applied to the experience of symbols itself, for freedom from the tyranny of (what) the symbol (represents). I only see novelty in the way one approaches symbolic experience
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Replying to @qu137157 @Meaningness
one may certainly question it
it's what some things i see happening look like to me, i ain't married to it
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Replying to @chaosprime @Meaningness
Then let me say a little more about it before retiring for the night: I think forgetting spontaneous meaning happens when we hit roadbumps in our *endogenous* mechanisms that overwhelm our ability to just remember.. or missing meaning arising comes from an underwhelmed system's
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inability to forget (so that meaning can present itself afresh).. **or when there's a blindness to that these processes happen and can autocorrect when known**. Smth like that
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I didn’t really understand this conversation, but I found it very interesting, thank you!
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Replying to @Meaningness @chaosprime
Tldr afaik
@chaosprime was saying there's intellectual/social stuff that gets in the way of the meaning from just living, and I was saying that stuff doesn't get in the way but expecting that stuff to be something that it isn't can0 replies 0 retweets 0 likesThanks. Twitter will use this to make your timeline better. UndoUndo
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