“And the only way to reboot history is to figure out new beings to be. Because that’s ultimately what beefing is about: a way to avoid being, without allowing time itself to end.”
@vgr on forgetting the internet culture war by remembering purpose:https://www.ribbonfarm.com/2020/01/16/the-internet-of-beefs/ …
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Interesting (albeit horrifying) reading the comments on this. They boil down to “but MY side of the culture war is CORRECT, so telling people to stop is EVIL.” I get this quite a lot too.
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Replying to @Meaningness @vgr
Zanzi Retweeted Zanzi
me and
@mwotton were just talking about it. if the goal is to fix the beef, then a lot of the meta-conversations we're having do more harm than good. we need a framework that helps *resolve* the beef, not dismisses beef-havers as illogical culture warriorshttps://twitter.com/tangled_zans/status/1220722481755041792 …Zanzi added,
Zanzi @tangled_zansReplying to @davidgerard @mwotton and 2 othersIt does, but my stance on this is that rationalists/scc/IDW have done 'going-meta' *wrong* - ie by trying to rally against tribalism, they've trapped themselves in another tribe. A lot of my tweets are an attempt to reformulate a 'better' meta-level.1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes -
I agree, definitely! I made suggestions about how to resolve the culture war (v1.0) here:https://meaningness.com/completing-countercultures …
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Replying to @Meaningness @tangled_zans and
Oh, hmm, sorry, that's actually not the page I had in mind (although it's relevant). I was thinking of this one. (But it would need updating for Culture War 2.0, which I intended to do back in 2013, but didn't get to. Maybe someday!)https://meaningness.com/counterculture-war …
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Replying to @Meaningness @tangled_zans and
Particularly this bit toward the end. I suggest it would be helpful for participants to admit that there’s a mixture of substantive conflicts and symbolic ones. Substantive ones actually matter and are often amenable to pragmatic compromises or win-win strategies.pic.twitter.com/ZrOHPcYSJw
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Thank you! Both have been good reading so far. Lots of the ideas overlap with how I see things as well. The key difference that I'm articulating is that rather than rejecting both "sides" and finding a meta-description ('you're not fighting about values but status') 1/
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Replying to @tangled_zans @Meaningness and
The way forward is to instead *accept* both views as "valid in their context". youd still need to help them clarify what their *substantative* demands are, but this way you can get them to listen to you
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Yes, I agree strongly. Writing the “countercultures” chapter was for me in part a personal exercise in understanding where Evangelical conservatives were coming from, and sympathizing with their pov (despite being “on the other side” on most issues).pic.twitter.com/cQSQbI4K5k
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