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Meaningness's profile
David Chapman
David Chapman
David Chapman
@Meaningness

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David Chapman

@Meaningness

Better ways of thinking, feeling, and acting—around problems of meaning and meaninglessness; self and society; ethics, purpose, and value.

meaningness.com/about-my-sites
Joined September 2010

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    1. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay @_awbery_

      I think of this stance as kinda tantric/dzogchenic; here something feeling bad doesn't matter, if it serves the mind-system's purposes.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay @_awbery_

      Where "serves the mind-system's purposes" is defined as "the mind-system in general endorsing the emotion as useful for the situation".

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      2) a stance that's more focused on doing some particular thing and maintaining focus on it, noting that distractions feel bad and letting the mind-system drop them.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    4. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      I think of this one as kinda sutric in that it tries to drop desires which produce bad feelings; but then that is also happening in service of some greater purpose rather than for its own sake, so I don't think of it as renunciate as such.

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    5. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      And the general principle uniting them is something like "suffering involves parts of the mind fighting for control; dis-identifying from the parts causes the mind to get more information so that there's no fighting/suffering, though there may still be negative emotions".

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      With the two stances operating on different levels of the same principle; maybe something like the first one looking at the content of the internal conflicts and the second one at the structure, and resolving conflicts at that level.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      They support each other: internalizing no-self on a deep level makes it easier to deal with difficult content, and dealing with difficult content makes it easier to stay in a state of mind which is conducive for insight work. Eventually (I hope) they merge into a seamless whole.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 17 Apr 2019
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      (here my model is similar to Romeo Stevens's: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/ZawRiFR8ytvpqfBPX/the-hard-work-of-translation-buddhism … )

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    9. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 17 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay @_awbery_

      [thinking out loud here, pretty uncertain about this] a strong point of presentations like Culadasa's and Shinzen's is lots of coherent technical detail. @_awbery_ is pointing out that this is against a (mostly but not completely) suppressed sutric conceptual background that >

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    10. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 17 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay @_awbery_

      > most tech people would reject if they knew about it. The tantric view is more compatible with the contemporary secular one, but not only are the practices inaccessible, so mostly are the technical details of its logic. >

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      David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 17 Apr 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay @_awbery_

      >I have a draft post titled "The Logic of Tantra" which would lay out the framework within which those details fit. I've actually deliberately not finished/published it because I semi-believe giving rationalists technical details to chew on may encourage their worst tendencies! >

      3:27 PM - 17 Apr 2019
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        2. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 17 Apr 2019
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          Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay @_awbery_

          > OTOH, if the only way to make the worldview accessible is to lay out the fiddly technical stuff first, and present the yana bottom-up (rather than top-down, from principles toward practices, as I've tried to do), maybe that's the right thing. >

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        3. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 17 Apr 2019
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          Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay @_awbery_

          > Maybe in fact that's what @_awbery_ has in mind when they talk about presenting vajrayana in a STEM framework; I don't know!

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        4. End of conversation

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