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Meaningness's profile
David Chapman
David Chapman
David Chapman
@Meaningness

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David Chapman

@Meaningness

Better ways of thinking, feeling, and acting—around problems of meaning and meaninglessness; self and society; ethics, purpose, and value.

meaningness.com/about-my-sites
Joined September 2010

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    1. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay @Meaningness @ribbonfarm

      Since they are seen as complimentary aspects of the same art, rather than two distinct things. Ideally if this new narrative would take hold, then everyone would end up yellow by default, since there was no reason to have loyalty to just one of them.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    2. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay @Meaningness @ribbonfarm

      But this makes me averse of approaches where yellow is explicitly contrasted with orange and made to be a totally different thing. I think that's again emphasizing differences and making them more salient, which feels like the opposite of what I think would be a good strategy.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Kaj Sotala‏ @xuenay 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay @Meaningness @ribbonfarm

      That said, it's plausible that your strategy is better than mine; it could be that the difference is already so salient in people's minds, that you *have* to address it explicitly in those terms, and that my approach is doomed.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    4. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @xuenay

      You raise excellent points here, and I’m sympathetic to the approach you are taking. I certainly agree that minimizing conflict is worthwhile. On other points, the best way forward is not clear to me. Let me point out some possible objections and alternatives…

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    5. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      I’m not a spiral dynamics expert, and don’t really buy the framework, but my understanding is that according to it green and orange actually do contradict. Yellow is not just combining them, or accepting both; you can’t do that.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      Yellow “transcends and includes” both orange and green. The “transcends” means a qualitative transformation based on explicitly understanding the internal logic of the others, seeing both their strengths and failure modes, and constructing something different from both.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      In Kegan’s framework, the “holding environment” has to both push you out of your current stage and draw you into the next. He uses the words “challenge” and “contradict” for the pushing. The environment has to say “no, this is not adequate any more,” which isn’t easy to hear.

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    8. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      At the social, cultural, and historical level, rationality is not adequate anymore. It has not been adequate for a century, and has conclusively failed. This is an urgent crisis imo.https://meaningness.com/systems-crisis-breakdown …

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    9. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      Pedagogically, how can we most effectively & efficiently train people in metarationality? No one yet knows. Your suggestion of training it along with rationality is attractive and plausible.

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    10. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      In the Bongard post, and other places, I’ve emphasized “this is something you are already doing without noticing; the next step is to see clearly what this thing is, and then you can start to learn to do it better.”

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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      Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

      I would love to reform the undergraduate curriculum to do that. This seems unrealistic in the short term, however. In the current world, the possibility of metarationality only comes into view once you have become proficient in rationality and then seen its limitations.

      9:33 AM - 22 Mar 2019
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        2. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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          Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

          It’s plausible that you can seduce people some way along the path to metarationality by (mis)presenting it as “advanced rationality.” That will probably work best for many people! Especially those who learn best by starting with concrete skills before understanding principles.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. David Chapman‏ @Meaningness 22 Mar 2019
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          Replying to @Meaningness @xuenay

          Given very limited resources, and very limited knowledge of what might work, I am pursuing an alternative pedagogical approach, of clearly laying out the principles and concepts from the beginning. That may work best for people who (like me) need to get the big picture first.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
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