In our time we also have failed institutions and little hope of reforming them from within. We don't seem to have a strategy as effective as the repression norms though.
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Replying to @danlistensto @Meaningness
Not denying the new failure modes, but all organizations are always failing, and never reform themselves without social encouragement. Even eg. journalism and higher ed are still doing a lot of the right stuff, just at a high social cost.
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Heck, even the federal govt is keeping us supplied with bread and circuses. Prob most Americans feel legislative gridlock is a problem, but failure to push thru symbolic legislation is prob the best outcome when nobody agrees on what to do.
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Replying to @robamacl @Meaningness
failure to push through effective non-symbolic legislation seems like the bigger problem but that's a tangent to this discussion, which is about the excesses of extremists in the culture war. where do norms come from and how they are enforced? where do replacements originate?
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Replying to @danlistensto @Meaningness
First you have to have some consensus that this is indeed excessive. I wonder if the ppl doing the real world actions (threatening calls, etc.) are telling ppl they did, and getting praised? I'd like to know.
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Are ppl personally telling them they did good? Not just the knowing it happened (anonymous) and saying "yes, punch Nazis" on Twitter. In antifa this is a thing, but niche AFAICT.
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Thing is, there's a lot of kayfabe going around, or to coin a dubious concept, unconscious kayfabe. Now, talking favorably about civil war is an important step toward one, but there is a lot of verbal violence which is IMO figurative, performative.
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I don't mean that ppl are consciously not serious, or consciously angling for ingroup status. It's just that all these ppl are saying this shit, and it's getting rewarded. So, a no-brainer to follow the model.
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In that sense, it's very dangerous, b/c hard to rein in ppl who actually do what you are advocating, and risk of losing face if you back down, making collective return to sanity difficult.
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Just realized this ties back to whether gpt-2 is at all human level. It imitates what ppl say on the internet, without knowing what it is talking about. Well, humans do that too, imitate speech without grounding in the world of actions nominally under discussion.
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... which is why it’s easy to write a political spam generator.
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