The defense is asking the court to make a determination as to whether the charges are political offences as might be determined by a US court, Lewis says, which is not the function of an extradition hearing.
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There is presumably an area outside of the courtroom where Pierce is able to confer with her client.
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“I am as much a participant in these proceedings as a spectator at Wimbledon,” Assange told the magistrate at the outset of the exchange. If I heard correctly, he alleged that there were “unnamed embassy staff” in the courtroom listening to his discussions with his lawyers.
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Assange is now back in the courtroom. His defense team remains outside conferring.
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One note about the setup of the courtroom to clarify all this: Assange is seated on a bench in a glass-enclosed area at the back of the courtroom. If he wishes to speak directly to his lawyers, he must do so through gaps in the bullet-proof glass of the enclosure.
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Defense is asking whether Assange could be removed from the dock (the glass enclosure), and could sit with his Defense team, saying that they understand the prosecutors do not object to this. Baraitser says that she suspects the security team will not agree to this.
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Baraitser asks Fitzgerald if he really thinks she is able to adjudicate on a matter related to security, or if he wishes to make an application for bail to permit Assange to leave the dock.
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Fitzgerald says that the defense team will make an application for bail to allow Assange to sit outside the dock.
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Lewis says that the prosecution has no issue with Assange sitting in the well of the court with security officers on either side, but that they will not agree to him being released from custody.
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Surrender to the court involves surrender to the dock, Baraitser says, adding that release from the dock requires an application for release from custody and therefore an application for bail.
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Lewis, Fitzgerald and Baraitser agree that they will take a night to consider how to proceed with regards to Assange staying in the dock, or sitting beside his defense attorneys in the “well of the court.”
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The hearing proceeds with Assange remaining in the dock for the present.
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After the brief burst of relative drama regarding Assange’s ability to communicate with his attorneys, we carry on with Lewis belaboring rather dry points of law with regard to the relationship between international treaties and English domestic law.
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The defense is trying to get a non-established right in through the back door, by attempting to create that right using the guise of “abuse of process,” Lewis is arguing, saying that if you incorporate a right using an unincorporated treaty, you deny Parliament’s sovereignty.
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Clair Dobbin confers with Lewis, who clarifies: It would not be right to say that a right has been abolished by omission: the [2003] Act describes what the court can take into account, eg Is there a bar to extradition or is there not?
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Outside of what is described in the 2003 extradition act, “you cannot introduce other matters into the hearing as applicable” for abuse of process, Lewis says.
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“Parliament has expressly abrogated the ‘political offence’ exception,” Lewis says. “The Parliamentary intention was to remove it.” “Madam, that really is determinative of the issue,” Lewis says, adding that extradition hearings have very limited jurisdiction.
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We pause once again as the magistrate inquires whether Assange is able to continue. Gareth Pierce is conferring with Assange.
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Pierce and Fitzgerald now conferring; they both go back to the dock to speak to Assange.
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“Mr Assange is prepared to soldier on,” Fitzgerald tells the court.
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Whether there is a legal difference in interpretation between the phrase “political offence” in the US and UK is now at the center of the discussion. Baraitser asking Lewis to clarify if his assertion is that the term “political offence” is legally the same in the US and the UK.
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We pause the proceedings; Assange (through Gareth Pierce) tells his defense team that he is having difficulties.
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The court adjourns. Assange raises his fist above his head toward his supporters in the public gallery as he exits the dock. The hearing will continue tomorrow.
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End of conversation
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