Maya Forstater on Twitter: "I don't think it's misleading. It's just a different metric. The IFS graph is not misleading because it doesn't allocate millitary spending. People understand that there is a difference between benefits that net against tax to out cash in yr pocket & spending on public services… https://t.co/bSzO5saHPw"

@MForstater

Business and sustainable development. Accountability. Tax. Feminist test case. Media: Tom Gardner at Slater & Gordon 0207 657 1690 press@slatergordon.co.uk

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Lyman Expand the House Stone, AKA 石來民‏ @lymanstoneky Oct 12

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Lyman Expand the House Stone, AKA 石來民 Retweeted Gabriel Zucman

This figure excludes refundable tax credits like the child tax credit and the EITC, which disproportionately benefit the poor.https://twitter.com/gabriel_zucman/status/1183144189351153664 …

Lyman Expand the House Stone, AKA 石來民 added,

Gabriel Zucman @gabriel_zucman

A far better metric is the effective tax rate paid by each group of the population, distributing 100% of the total tax take across the population. Then you get this picture, which shows the evolution of effective tax rates between 1962 and 2018 pic.twitter.com/yRh9UJCy00

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Gabriel Zucman‏ @gabriel_zucman Oct 12

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Replying to @lymanstoneky

It also excludes military spending, which many believe disproportionately benefits the rich. It distributes 100% of the total tax take of the US, no more no less.

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Maya Forstater‏ @MForstater Oct 12

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Replying to @gabriel_zucman @lymanstoneky

Thats not a very satisfactory answer. For a household surely the important metric is the cash they have to spend after tax & benefits. Looking only at one and not the other is only part of the story -- e.g. as @TheIFS tell in the UKpic.twitter.com/SDVPjTOFJg

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Gabriel Zucman‏ @gabriel_zucman Oct 12

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Replying to @MForstater @lymanstoneky @TheIFS

Who pays what in taxes is important in itself. The total redistributive effects of government intervention is important to. But to study it you need to be comprehensive: allocate all taxes and all spending (which this graph does not do)

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Maya Forstater‏ @MForstater Oct 12

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Replying to @gabriel_zucman @lymanstoneky @TheIFS

Sure, but there is a difference between not allocating all public spending (on defense, healthcare, education etc ) & not considering impact of individual benefits which increase/decrease cash in people's pockets.

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Maya Forstater‏ @MForstater Oct 12

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Replying to @MForstater @gabriel_zucman and

Not doing one is not the answer to why not look at the other. From a household point of view the salient ETR measure is surely difference between market earnings and take home pay. Eg if govt cuts yr tax but also cuts yr benefits you are no better off.

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Gabriel Zucman‏ @gabriel_zucman Oct 12

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Replying to @MForstater @lymanstoneky @TheIFS

What if gov cuts NHS spending and you can’t have public health care anymore? Not sure why only cash transfers matter. You want to be comprehensive: 100% of taxes, 100% of transfers.

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Maya Forstater‏ @MForstater Oct 12

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Replying to @gabriel_zucman @lymanstoneky @TheIFS

This is a thread about the meaningfulness of metrics. There is no rule that says you can't look at net effects of taxes & cash benefits on take home pay *unless* you also allocate public goods like millitary spending as a benefit per household.

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Gabriel Zucman‏ @gabriel_zucman Oct 12

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Replying to @MForstater @lymanstoneky @TheIFS

I just gave you an example of how this could be misleading

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Maya Forstater‏ @MForstater Oct 12

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Replying to @gabriel_zucman @lymanstoneky @TheIFS

I don't think it's misleading. It's just a different metric. The IFS graph is not misleading because it doesn't allocate millitary spending. People understand that there is a difference between benefits that net against tax to out cash in yr pocket & spending on public services

6:49 PM - 12 Oct 2019

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