Maya Forstater

The aim of some schools of Feminism yes, to remove gender as it's a system of sex rank. But we aren't in that world yet obviously. Nobody likes sexism, or stereotyping, but why say you are gender-free, how would this even be possible in our so gendered society?

It means I don't personally subscribe to those rules because gender is not innate, though I understand there are people who do feel they have an internal gender. It's important to say so at this moment because there is a very loud narrative that everyone has an innate gender

Ok, I just think it might be considerate if ppl clarified that gender-free doesn't mean free of gendered presentation or free of normative gendered presentation, because it's a particular life experience not being easily coded by others as gendered.

Most women if they put on, say, jeans and a plain boxy t-shirt, without make up or hair styling are immediately recognisable as women. Its not "gendered presentation" that is being read, but they are still subject to gendered expectations.

That's your experience. I'm routinely read as a young man or as a what's that. I'm female. I think you really underestimate how rigid gender norms are & how quickly ppl make snap judgements about others based on v basic stereotypical outward gender cues.

Yes I agree people make snap judgements based on gender norms. But my point is people also read sex (and then bundle it up with gendered expectations) in the absence of *any* external gendered clothing cues...

... So the idea that women who are routinely read as female, must be putting on a some external form of gendered expression also does not work.