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Jonathan_Blow's profile
Jonathan Blow
Jonathan Blow
Jonathan Blow
@Jonathan_Blow

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Jonathan Blow

@Jonathan_Blow

Game designer of Braid and The Witness. Partner in IndieFund.

San Francisco
the-witness.net/news
Joined January 2010

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    1. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
      • Report Tweet

      When Unix was released, the USA was still doing missions to the moon ... that's how long ago it was!

      6 replies 9 retweets 64 likes
      Show this thread
    2. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      It may be old, but wouldn't it be neat if people were… learning and using it? Instead of reimplementing all the things they don't know it already provides? I've seen so much software that would be little more than a slim slice of bash and make… if only people knew their unix…

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @skore_de

      Except, people hate using things made from bash and make, because they are buggy and clumsy and have weird failure states. That's at least part of the reason. The other part is there are 30 trillion programs installed, how is anyone supposed to know what is even there?

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    4. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      My experience is that people hate base level unix tools (and come on, there are like three dozen that count) because they vastly overestimate their ability to improve upon them, regardless of how buggy and clumsy they are. And I'm not even sure that they are.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
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      Replying to @skore_de

      It shouldn't be hard to improve on them. They are from the 1970s. If we don't have better ideas 50 years later, we suck real bad. I agree that many people *don't* improve on them, but that is a different story.

      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
    6. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      Well... Rust community is currently making a credible effort of doing that properly. Following them with great interest. I'd use make reimplemented in Rust in a heartbeat (if well done etc.)

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
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      Replying to @skore_de @Jonathan_Blow

      Check out stuff like ripgrep and follow the trail if this is news to you. 🙇

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
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      Replying to @skore_de

      I think it's a good idea to rewrite things so that they are known to be more-correct, but the RIIR movement is not going to make things that much simpler, because the core problem is not the actual source code.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
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      Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

      Hmm, I thought your main objection was the stuff about "they are buggy and clumsy and have weird failure states". For me as a spectator, it seems like they're at least following the right trail in that regard...

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
      • Report Tweet
      Replying to @skore_de

      Well that's one objection of many. But a big part of the bugginess is not the bugginess of the individual programs, it's that they are combined via loose coupling, communicating with non-statically-typed textual data.

      10:19 AM - 23 May 2019
      • 3 Likes
      • Ivan Braidi . de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}
      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
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          Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

          man... I'm actually SUPER torn on that one. A lot of devs might benefit from not getting anything but passing textual data as it could help them to see the complexity they're piling on top of basic, textual data...

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @skore_de

          Okay, but doing that under the Unix Philosophy is like programming in Javascript and passing strings between all your functions ... exactly the opposite of the idea of writing stuff in Rust. It does not scale.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
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          Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @skore_de

          Actually, it's like programming in Tcl, even worse than programming in Javascript...

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        5. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

          Hah! Well, I wouldn't subscribe to that interpretation. There is communication between programs and the files they operate on between them. The latter part is definitely whrer you want well specced and designed stuff. "oh just handle text for chrissake" has its place tho imho

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @skore_de

          I think it's fine to have text as an option. But you should also be able to get structured + fast data instead.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        7. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @Jonathan_Blow

          Yes! I guess I'm just tired of seeing people building their babylonian towers when more than half of their designs could be moved to the OS, making the other half a lot more pleasant to deal with.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @skore_de @Jonathan_Blow

          That's my working hypothesis, anyhow. So far, it has not stopped astonishing me with how much complexity you can avoid with it. I don't have a final verdict, though.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        9. de {curr. riding the BEST TL straight out of HELL}‏ @skore_de May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @skore_de @Jonathan_Blow

          Also - I'm mostly working on (web) content, which I know you don't have much love for, so our perspectives are quite different.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        10. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. sighalt‏ @sighalt May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @skore_de

          I thought the everything-is-a-file paradigm in conjunction with these small, interoperable programs, handling only byte streams, were the actual key to success. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Jonathan Blow‏ @Jonathan_Blow May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @sighalt @skore_de

          It was the actual key to success in 1970.

          2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        4. sighalt‏ @sighalt May 23
          • Report Tweet
          Replying to @Jonathan_Blow @skore_de

          So? Which problem are you trying to solve?

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. End of conversation

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