Post-rats have a more 'dissociated' vibe in my experience, or otherwise more likely to be further along the spiritual path.
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Replying to @msutherl @mechanicalmonk1 and
Why is this dissociated vibe a sign of development? I don't think I'm capable of taking ideas as seriously as Eliezer does, of keeping the same single-minded focus, of changing my life and habits by the force of pure reason. But I consider this a weakness, not a sign of progress.
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Really enjoyed the banter up to this point, room for one more? It feels easy to stereotype rats & post-rats when we point at the nebulous/abstract 'concept' of a rat/post-rat (concepts which vary from person to person).
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I think about the rat vs post-rat distinction from an Adult Development Theory perspective. Don't all meta-systematic thinkers emerge from a systematic stage?
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Learning the rationality toolkit seriously up-leveled how I interacted with the world. I became way better at reducing & working with uncertainty, building accurate beliefs, & intentionally acquiring new skills/habits. Then I started to hit limitations...
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Rationality didn't help reconcile my ethics with the different ethics of my friends. It didn't have language to describe We-spaces. It kind of got in the way of certain meditative paths. The only tool that seemed to help was to 'zoom out' and use rationality on the meta-level.
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For me, describing the difference between rats & post-rats is akin to describing elementary students & high-schoolers. Traditional thinkers vs modern thinkers. I'm not sure rats are deciding not to become post rats, that growth seems to happen naturally in certain contexts.
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This brings me back to my recurring issue: I don't see why more expansive practices for introspection aren't necessarily rational, so I don't currently see the point of the distinction. My suspicion is that it's mostly semantics...
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Yeah! I could define 'rationality' to include all the ways of thinking that help me get what I want (including meditation, contextualization, systems thinking...) but if the word gets too big, it becomes less useful.
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The distinction between rationality vs meta-rationality feels helpful for me to cleave the concepts in thing-space - the systematic ways of thinking I learned from LessWrong/CFAR, vs the meta-skill the helps me use that and other toolkits in context.
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That makes sense! Maybe it comes down to toolkit vs law viewpoints.
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