There's a nice piece on American conservatives and Hungary in NYT Magazine today, and reading some of the conservatives in there made me think it might be worth pointing something obvious out: Hungary isn't Americahttps://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/19/magazine/viktor-orban-rod-dreher.html …
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It seems to me that the pro-Hungary conservatives have cause and effect partly backward. They look at Hungarian conservative/illiberal democracy, and see a model for America. But they're mainly seeing the effect of a more conservative/illiberal electorate
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You can call Hungary a defender of 'western civ,' but this is not a nation with American, liberal, individualist, democratic values. It's a Catholic, conservative nation with roots in the Austro-Hungarian Empire, a conservative-nationalist Kingdom and time in the Eastern Bloc
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It's kind of obvious, but you're going to get a more conservative outcome in country with that kind of electorate. Take this nice Pew chart of support for gay marriage among *Catholics,* by country. Democracy leads to different outcomes.pic.twitter.com/AnAKPMKNfo
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For all the critiques of Hungarian illiberal democracy (and there are real restrictions on press freedom etc), Orban won power by winning the popular vote *53 to 19* in a multiparty system. That's the source of his power, not subsequent conservative policies
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It is also worth noting that overreach has led to a unified anti-Orban opposition that might well even cost him power. Polls show a very different race rn https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/18/world/europe/hungary-viktor-orban-election.html …pic.twitter.com/gH3aiDUYXK
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It would be healthy for American conservatives to aspire to winning elections decisively. But they won't; real issue is with the culture/voters. They say as much: they're embracing Orbanism in hopes of checking a prevailing liberal culture.
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That is backward: Orbanism is a reflection of a conservative culture than the cause of it. And while conservatives can win in America, the idea that they could then implement Orbanist policies and turn American culture into Hungary is just not really credible
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In contrast, a classical liberal individualist culture runs extremely deep in America. It provides conservatives with a far more plausible, broadly held foundation for contesting a 'woke' 'illiberal' left. Working with it, not against it, is fairly clearly in their interest
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Neoconservatism--which drew much of its intellectual strength from the old Left, old New Dealers, etc.--is the more obvious precedent for a successful conservative pushback against a 'new left.' You can think of Obama-backing Twitter accts and Substacks that fit the bill today
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You are right about the political logic but telling paleo-cons that they should become neo-cons isn't going to work since the whole basis of paleo politics is the belief that neo-cons betrayed core right principles & have left feminists/LGBTQ win.
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Replying to @HeerJeet @Nate_Cohn
War and trade are bigger deals for most paleocons. Q
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