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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Necco Wafers and Smarties aren't real candy‏ @shouldITbonfire May 1
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      I think this is one of the most nuanced and important discussions never had in civics class. The right of the majority to dictate through government vs the rights of the minority. Is our bill of rights beyond reach of government? If not then, are they still rights?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
      Replying to @shouldITbonfire

      If most of you wanted to become a Marxist or Islamist or Christian dominionist or whatever state, its hard to see how the bill of rights would stop that. America as a society would decide to change the basis of its government.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
      Replying to @HPluckrose @shouldITbonfire

      Your bill of rights is only safe for as long as Americans generally value it. Imagine if you somehow became predominantly Sharia supporting Muslims overnight. What would make you respect the authority and history of that?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Necco Wafers and Smarties aren't real candy‏ @shouldITbonfire May 1
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      Absolutely! That's where the ethics argument gets fun! What is majority rule weighted against the consent of the governed. My government (for the past few decades) doesn't value a lot of things regarding individual liberty, even when a majority do value them - is that tyranny?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
      Replying to @shouldITbonfire

      I'm not talking about ethics for a change. I'm talking about a much simpler reality that the rules of a country reflect the societal norms within it because society makes the rules.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Necco Wafers and Smarties aren't real candy‏ @shouldITbonfire May 1
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      Does society actually make law? Our last election would have been decided (one way or the other) by ~45 Million, numerous eligible voters don't vote, nore are minors and other members of society. 60 Million Pastafarians could make Sagnarelli Law a reality.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
      Replying to @shouldITbonfire

      I am not talking about this. I am speaking on a much larger timescale in which yes, society changes and with it laws. Its not a coincidence that secular liberal democracies exist where the Enlightenment happened and Muslim theocracies exist where most people are Muslim.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. Necco Wafers and Smarties aren't real candy‏ @shouldITbonfire May 1
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      So to be clear, you are referring society (as it pertains to values) influencing government over a period generations (decades and centuries). As those moral values change over generations so then does the laws and governments.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
      Replying to @shouldITbonfire

      Yes, exactly. Look at how England has changed over the last 2000 years. The zeitgeist changes and with it society and with it government even if at various stages, it upholds some values which are at odds with the majority.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. Necco Wafers and Smarties aren't real candy‏ @shouldITbonfire May 1
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      Got Ya! With that, do you think its possible for any culture or society to resist change. Even some of the most hardline cultures that have actively resisted reformation for fundamentalism are softening. (Ex: Women Protesting in Iran; China's talent for capitalism)

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
      Replying to @shouldITbonfire

      No. There is no evidence I know of of any society having resisted change. They have all evolved culturally and intellectually. Its a thing societies do.

      5:15 PM - 1 May 2018
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Necco Wafers and Smarties aren't real candy‏ @shouldITbonfire May 1
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          Of course they evolve, my question is more along the lines of what path they follow. If a society can evolve to be more liberated/free/liberal then it makes sense they should be able to evolve to be more authoritarian/restricted/conservative ... by have any?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 1
          Replying to @shouldITbonfire

          The moral arc is generally positive but we shouldn't count on it remaining so. Even if it only backtracks temporarily like in the fascist/communist genocides and hopefully in the Iranian revolution its enough to ruin millions of lives.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. End of conversation

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