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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Diana S. Fleischman‏ @sentientist Apr 16

      Diana S. Fleischman Retweeted Helen Pluckrose

      A very good point from @HPluckrose on the origins of "tribe" which may or may not save the word "tribalism" ht @thedecenttechhttps://twitter.com/HPluckrose/status/985810395737874432 …

      Diana S. Fleischman added,

      Helen Pluckrose @HPluckrose
      Except that 'tribe' comes from Latin via *English* which originally comes from England and was most commonly used to refer to ancient Hebrew groups within Christianity & applied retrospectively to Iron Age Britons and much, much, much later to Native Americans. Good grief. https://twitter.com/dylanmatt/status/985657017569370112 …
      3 replies 4 retweets 24 likes
      Show this thread
    2. 𒀭 🎃Jonathan (jack-o’-lantern annexed to diĝir)‏ @JSimonNathan Apr 16
      Replying to @sentientist @HPluckrose @TheDecentTech

      Not quite on the mark: see Lewis and Short's explanationpic.twitter.com/NMG4WA9gpG

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
      Replying to @JSimonNathan @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      That's the Latin.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. 𒀭 🎃Jonathan (jack-o’-lantern annexed to diĝir)‏ @JSimonNathan Apr 16
      Replying to @HPluckrose @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      Yep!

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
      Replying to @JSimonNathan @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      So, do we disagree?

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. 𒀭 🎃Jonathan (jack-o’-lantern annexed to diĝir)‏ @JSimonNathan Apr 16
      Replying to @HPluckrose @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      I think we do—the application to the Israelite tribes is derived from be generic sense of the word, which is common in both ancient Latin and medieval vernacular languages

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
      Replying to @JSimonNathan @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      I'm still not sure how that counters my statement that the English word has its origins in Latin but was used in sense of tribes mostly for Hebrew tribes in a Christian context and then applied to ancient Britons. Do you not think it was?

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. 𒀭 🎃Jonathan (jack-o’-lantern annexed to diĝir)‏ @JSimonNathan Apr 16
      Replying to @HPluckrose @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      I don't disagree strongly, I just don't think it's safe to overemphasize the word's semantic connection to the tribes of Israel; nor to sever the Latin word too cleanly from the English

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
      Replying to @JSimonNathan @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      I don't think that's the point here tho. Americans have the word 'tribe' from the English who have used it historically primarily to describe the tribes of Israel & then ancient Britons. Therefore it is not the property of Native Americans. The end. Your point can also be true.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    10. 𒀭 🎃Jonathan (jack-o’-lantern annexed to diĝir)‏ @JSimonNathan Apr 16
      Replying to @HPluckrose @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      I buy your conclusion (obviously no word is any set of people's property) regardless of my quibbles with your premisses

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
      Replying to @JSimonNathan @sentientist @TheDecentTech

      But what is the premise you are quibbling with? I want to know if you think I am wrong about historical use of the word in English because I might be. I study English Christian history 1300-1700 and there could be contexts I don't know.

      1:53 PM - 16 Apr 2018
      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        1. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
          Replying to @HPluckrose @JSimonNathan and

          That is the only claim I have made and if you disagree with it, you are quibbling with the point I made. If you are pointing out it was used differently in Rome where it is derived from that is not a quibble but an additional tangential fact which I also know to be true.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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