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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

    Helen Pluckrose Retweeted Areo

    OK, tweeps, here we go. I will be responding to this shortly. Pls read with an open mind. This is a good faith perspective on benefits of postmodernism from someone who sees the problem with what many (but not he) call the postmodern left. I disagree with his take on it, ofc.https://twitter.com/AreoMagazine/status/985725463778639872 …

    Helen Pluckrose added,

    Areo @AreoMagazine
    The Necessity of Postmodernism in the Post-Truth Age https://areomagazine.com/2018/04/15/the-necessity-of-postmodernism-in-the-post-truth-age/ …
    12:45 AM - 16 Apr 2018
    • 17 Retweets
    • 49 Likes
    • Sean Ryan Victor Baker³ E Ull apples don't pee The Grey Girl Chris Kennedy canknuckle ☣ Slicin' Hammer ⚠️ Sebastian Correa
    5 replies 17 retweets 49 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        But it is useful because it argues much more clearly and honestly than often the case for what many see as the important role of deconstructing & challenging comfortable assumptions provided by pomo. I think this ultimately erroneous coz assumes pomo only & good way to do this

        3 replies 4 retweets 8 likes
        Show this thread
      3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        I think it makes common error in its perception of role & nature of science by practically conflating it with 'common sense' (a comfortable metanarrative) but opens up possibility of productive conversation between ppl who value scepticism & critical interrogation of assumptions.

        1 reply 4 retweets 10 likes
        Show this thread
      4. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        About the best way to do that. I, as you know, take the position that pomo is a terrible way to do that because it dismantles indiscriminately without a coherent method for evaluating worth of systems /sets of beliefs/epistemologies it targets. Critical analysis needs this.

        1 reply 3 retweets 14 likes
        Show this thread
      5. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        This is the difference between a radical scepticism which takes everything apart but does not allow for the existence of objective truth and a productive scepticism which takes things apart in the service of finding truth.

        1 reply 5 retweets 14 likes
        Show this thread
      6. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        The core of the problem with the original postmodernists was that they critiqued things on the grounds that they were metanarratives - large overarching explanations of complex phenomena - rather than on the grounds of whether or not they were true.

        1 reply 5 retweets 9 likes
        Show this thread
      7. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        Lyotards target "metanarratives" were Christianity, Marxism and science. It should be clear that if Christianity were true, it wouldnt matter in the slightest that it were also a large overarching explanation of complex phenomena. It would be the right explanation.

        2 replies 4 retweets 12 likes
        Show this thread
      8. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        The same is true of Marxism. If it explained society accurately, it wouldnt matter that that explanation were big and covered a lot of ground.

        1 reply 4 retweets 7 likes
        Show this thread
      9. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16

        Science isnt a metanarrative. Its a method but some of its theories are overarching explanations for complex phenomena - eg evolution fits that description perfectly. If the explanation is correct, it should not be suspicious purely on the grounds that it explains a lot.

        1 reply 7 retweets 26 likes
        Show this thread
      10. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Jeroen D‏ @Yerune_D Apr 16
        Replying to @HPluckrose

        It starts with a strawman that PoMO is to blame for everything, then does a No True Scottsman and basically ends up saying Peterson is a PoMo for being critical. I like the jist of the article, but I don't think it reflects PostModernism (today)

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
        Replying to @Yerune_D

        I think he misses the mark to quite an extent. I will be responding soon.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Jeroen D‏ @Yerune_D Apr 16
        Replying to @HPluckrose

        But kudo's to you, and the author, for willing to engage in this public discussion.

        1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
      5. Doctino‏ @SpartanMindPsy Apr 16
        Replying to @Yerune_D @HPluckrose

        A major issue for me, and this is the same charge for a lot of Pomo, there are no clear definitions or articulation of different strands within Pomo offered. The author does not even define Pomo. Perhaps this is because it's too difficult to to do, and this again a problem.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      6. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
        Replying to @SpartanMindPsy @Yerune_D

        I think he expects people to know which debates and which aspects of postmodernism he is referring to and, in fact, we nearly all do. I addressed that in this essay in the section: Claim: There is much more to postmodernism than its critics present.https://areomagazine.com/2018/02/07/no-postmodernism-is-not-dead-and-other-misconceptions/ …

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      7. Doctino‏ @SpartanMindPsy Apr 16
        Replying to @HPluckrose @Yerune_D

        With respect, this seems unreasonable and a poor assumption for an article defending it. I have studied discourse analysis and social constructivism during my phd and there are as many theories as there are Pomo academics. It's opaque and convoluted.

        1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
      8. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 16
        Replying to @SpartanMindPsy @Yerune_D

        Yes, I addressed that in my piece. It is better to see critics of postmodernism as working backwards from specific problems to their cause. We do need a better name for people who still seem confused about what is being criticised. @thesadredearth suggested 'New Logocentrism.;

        3 replies 1 retweet 1 like
      9. Doctino‏ @SpartanMindPsy Apr 17
        Replying to @HPluckrose @Yerune_D @thesadredearth

        That might be one of the best discussion and analysis of post modernism I have ever read. You do an excellent job of offering definitions and broad differences which really helped.

        0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      10. End of conversation
      1. Charre  🐸‏ @atheistsquid Apr 16
        Replying to @HPluckrose

        “Post-truth age” is off to a bad start.

        0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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      1. DarkEmper0r‏ @DarkEmper0r Apr 16
        Replying to @HPluckrose

        Are You going to make Youtube response video?

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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      1. Coffee is for closers‏ @MichaelFoster26 Apr 16
        Replying to @HPluckrose

        Too many words for a No True Scotsman argument. Pass.

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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