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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      That's not people, that's culture, and yes, it's definitely improved in many of those respects. "People being better" implies that were the laws and culture different, we good people would voluntarily do none of those things. I do not think that's true.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    2. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
      Replying to @RickVonJaeger @HPluckrose

      Coming from the religious perspective, you won't like or agree with this, but the long slow decline of people's spirits such that they value menial, superficial things over the states of their own soul and fellow men is not an improvement overall.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 2
      Replying to @RickVonJaeger @OldSaintRiot

      Why do you think this has happened tho? Fewer people believe in a soul but unlikely fewer believe in morality. We care much more about our fellow men now. Our circle of empathy has widened to other nations & we focus much more on wellbeing - welfare, humanitarian aid, laws etc

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    4. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      I don't see large amounts charity as proof that we care more about fellow men. Advancements in technology allow more people to give more, wealthier people can give more than poorer, and laws enabling charity subsidize additional giving.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    5. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 2
      Replying to @RickVonJaeger @OldSaintRiot

      Our easier lifestyles bring out the best of us and enable us to widen our circle of empathy.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    6. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      Enabling us to do more good, which has definitely happened, does not mean we're better people for it. A better person would be good more often whether or not it's easy to be good.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 2
      Replying to @RickVonJaeger @OldSaintRiot

      It's bigger than that. What has changed culture is security. When you're not fighting for the existence of yourself, family & tribe, you can look around more and widen your circle of empathy.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    8. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      I, uh, don't see how that contradicts the things we've been saying. Being alive and not having to worry about our tribes' survivals does enable us to do more good. Can't do much good when your tribe is dead or enslaved, obv.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 2
      Replying to @RickVonJaeger @OldSaintRiot

      I'm not sure what we're disagreeing on, Do you think we disagree? I was saying we have made moral progress. You have pointed out what helped that and I agreed that it did.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      Originally, I thought we did. I guess I confused "getting better" as we've become better people rather than becoming better behaved.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 2
      Replying to @RickVonJaeger @OldSaintRiot

      We've made moral progress in our societies. We used to think slavery was OK, now we don't. We used to think killing heretics was OK, now we don't. We used to think husband's beating wives was OK, now we don't. We used to think torture was OK, now we don't. Moral progress.

      12:28 PM - 2 Apr 2018
      • 1 Like
      • David Krae 📎
      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        1. New conversation
        2. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          I don't disagree that such is not progress, but having a better understanding of morality doesn't mean that you are a better person for it. If people *really* thought torture was okay, you could hardly say they were bad people for keeping slaves.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
          Replying to @RickVonJaeger @HPluckrose

          It's definitely better now in these respects, but it can also be worse in some respects. I hate to bring it up, but it's a good example to say that abortion in the USA would be one big way in which a society has worsened morally.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Apr 2
          Replying to @RickVonJaeger @OldSaintRiot

          No, I think that is also a sign of moral progress.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        5. Rick von SLAYger‏ @RickVonJaeger Apr 2
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          Okay, well, I do not think that, but you understand the point that it's possible to see things as a step backwards, yes?

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. End of conversation

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