Interesting. I have not tended to focus much on this problem within the socialist left, looking more at the problems in the identitarian left. I shall investigate.https://twitter.com/PeterTatchell/status/973930531254661120 …
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The radical left and the liberal left, in the UK, used to be utterly opposed but once an identitarian/postmodern branch sprouted out of the liberal side (some of which was taken on by a branch of radical side), the rest of us discovered we had more in common than we thought.
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Why is totalizing class identity any better than other identities? Seems to me they are all relevant in achieving more liberal social system.
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Not about identity. About measurable needs & providing for them.
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Surely those you accuse of engaging in identity politics would argue they are also concerned about measurable needs and providing for them?
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I am talking about economic needs. Basic human needs. People of both sexes, all races, all stations in life can require an economic safety net. I support this. This is not identitarian. It is to be available to everyone who needs it.
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Sure that's a problem and I'm not interested in defending it. But is that problem inherent in even considering non-class identities? It seems similarly wrong for someone to look at a wealthy business woman and respond to her complaints about workplace sexism with "but your rich!"
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Of course. I am making the point I am making and nothing else. Not sure where you are going. I am leaving it here.
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sorry didn't mean to be hostile. just trying to challenge what i see as an inconsistency. followed you after you were on econtalk, enjoy your work.
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And the old style- labour left consistently were the first to call out horrific treatment of the poor in rich societies, that liberals would eventually come to condemn, but only at the spurring of the left. They make the capitalist system better. nothing as redeeming in new left.
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This tweet didn’t age well. Now Marxists see you for your actual politics.
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I identify with the first and love Alan Sokal's phrase for it: "old-fashioned rational leftist."
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The term neo-liberal is used by the far left prejoritively. Maybe we should embrace old style liberalism. Maybe neo-liberal should be a badge of courage.
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I don’t know if I would be considered old-school left or new-school. A bit of both? I was heavily influenced by the New Left of the ‘60s and ‘70s, which includes MLK, Noam Chomsky, Angela Davis, and Stonewall.
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The identitarian left of today isn't the same as the New Left of the '60s and '70s. MLK and Chomsky certainly aren't identitarians. The former in fact was close to people in the Socialist Party and had attended the Highlander retreats.
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Likewise, because although an over emphasis on class can be reductive, I do agree that class is woefully under discussed/acknowledged by the intersectional/identitarian left.
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It’s often forgotten nowadays, but labour/unions/socialists used to be super pro-protectionism and very anti-immigration. Immigrants are often used as cheap labour and thus hinder the cause of labour rights, and protectionism is designed to prevent outsourcing.
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