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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere

      That doesn't prevent anyone from speaking. The line is at stopping people from hearing a speaker they have invited to speak.

      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
    2. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      We have more "free" or unfiltered speech available to >% of the population than ever in the history of civilization. There is no one platform to present ideas and the ideas protested here are not novel. Even those like ISIS have plenty of platforms to spread their speech.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere @HPluckrose

      My point is we need to distinguish between the actual limiting of free speech and the human right to protest a known idea someone find repugnant. I'm not defending their actions! But the conversation seems flawed.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    4. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere

      That's my point too. I support protests which don't prevent speakers from speaking or audiences from hearing the speaker they have invited to speak. That's the distinction. The people who protested at the event I did a couple of weeks ago, walked out & damaged the sound system.

      2 replies 0 retweets 5 likes
    5. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      I value your opinion and the courage you had to go up there! I could not disagree more with their methods or even reasons! But there is some really tricky nuance here that needs to be debated, not by me, (and then protested 😉) to delineate what is a violation of free speech.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere

      I think we're doing that. It is contrary to the principle of supporting the free exchange of diverse ideas to try to prevent someone from speaking or others from hearing her. It is cowardly & bullying when you could step up & show the problem with the speech.

      1 reply 1 retweet 6 likes
    7. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      But that's not the case for many people who are majority laymen and which goes back to my original point. Human interaction is not logical robots and never has been in the history of society. Ideas, historically, are bad, implemented, then modified.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    8. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere @HPluckrose

      I guess maybe I'll just have to rethink the position. In my mind, when a prevalent idea is established across many actors and platforms, I see no reason why interrupting an event constitutes infringement of free speech. Especially considering the history of effective protests.

      4 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    9. God's Ventriloquist‏ @godsven3loquist Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere @HPluckrose

      Using ones freedom of speech via protest to deny another’s is the epitome of hypocrisy. Express dissent, hold events that voice opposing opinions, attend and ask challenging questions. The heckler’s veto was the bane of the civil rights movement, we don’t want to go there.

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    10. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
      Replying to @godsven3loquist @HPluckrose

      I'm not defending rioting, but riots and the like have directly led to intervention in a positive manner throughout the history of the US. Haymaker riots was a huge turning point. I don't ever want it to get to that point but i'm not doing to deny effectiveness.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Mar 7
      Replying to @HereInThere @godsven3loquist

      https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/11/05/peaceful-protest-is-much-more-effective-than-violence-in-toppling-dictators/?utm_term=.4ce70874dfdc …

      5:54 AM - 7 Mar 2018
      • 1 Retweet
      • 3 Likes
      • (((ɹoqǝɹʇs ɹ ɔ))) Call It Like It is AtticusOz
      1 reply 1 retweet 3 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
          Replying to @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          ChemicalAgency Retweeted Yarrow Dunham

          My point would still stand because the effectiveness is predicated on the situation. A violent protest might have less rate of success but be more successful in certain situations.https://twitter.com/yarrowdunham/status/971024859483525122 …

          ChemicalAgency added,

          Yarrow Dunham @yarrowdunham
          Fascinating analysis of GSS data on opposition to free speech over the last 30+ years. Almost entirely at odds with conservative narrative. Overall support for allowing “controversial” views to be heard has maredly increased. 1/n . http://bit.ly/2FesZ0y  pic.twitter.com/peLpCrTnvN
          Show this thread
          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Mar 7
          Replying to @HereInThere @godsven3loquist

          Of course. I wonder if there have been more of them from good actors than bad tho? We've seen quite a few here, mostly from Islamists in the last few years. I really hope they are not effective.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
          Replying to @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          Well if you look at government spending or disruption of our daily lives, thoughts, I would say it has some non zero effectiveness. I'm thankful you've entertained my terrible rambling thoughts on this. I hear "free speech" so much it feels like a disservice to our past. 1/

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
          Replying to @HereInThere @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          I'll take a closer look at the boundary of shutting down the act of speech because we have grown as a society. Is there an acceptable disruptive protest? I'd like to see those questions answered by people much smarter than I but probably they already have been.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Liz Waters‏ @cdnwaters Mar 7
          Replying to @HereInThere @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          You can disrupt ideas without disrupting another person's right to speak or right to listen. Security needs to get active, trespassing charges laid and fingerprints taken. If people have faith in their actions, they should insist on paying the stated social costs of them.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
          Replying to @cdnwaters @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          Which they do. Plenty of these people are arrested or ostracized or face some societal punishment. That is a exactly how our system works and I find it to be a correct system more often than not. It is our willingness to vilify protests and their utility.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Liz Waters‏ @cdnwaters Mar 7
          Replying to @HereInThere @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          We have to keep in mind many protestors are indoctrinated kids doing the work of older ideologues. I want events to go off but also don't want to ruin a kid's life. tough to get both accomplished.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        9. ChemicalAgency‏ @HereInThere Mar 7
          Replying to @cdnwaters @HPluckrose @godsven3loquist

          Yes! A very difficult dilemma. Our need for punishment is much more pronounced than our ability to empathize which is a huge cause of friction. Leaving the door open for a historically useful tool (disruptive protest) ,with societal punishment as a reward, seems fair to me.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
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