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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Jan 7

    Helen Pluckrose Retweeted SuperSecretSigma

    By promoting liberalism over SocJus. I can't say it any more times. We have to win the battle of ideas. I'm going to leave this here. 'Progressives encourage racial tribalism so we need to stop immigration' is a ludicrous argument. ( @premodernism. It was ethnonationalism)https://twitter.com/Eidotheia/status/950111550987296768 …

    Helen Pluckrose added,

    SuperSecretSigma @Eidotheia
    Replying to @HPluckrose
    Uh... no it’s not. Progressivism has taken over most of the left. Progressive social policies are the norm. Social justice is championed. This is all racial tribalism. Liberalism didn’t stop tribalism. So how is liberalism going to stop the growing tribal populations?
    1:24 PM - 7 Jan 2018
    • 1 Retweet
    • 9 Likes
    • Daniel Inge Regina🎃 Ronald D. Potts 🇺🇲 Ferg Michael Mullaney Krav Swaga John Endres flabberghosted(Am I an NPC?)
    8 replies 1 retweet 9 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. Russ Erickson‏ @Russ_Erickson Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        I’m not opposed to immigration with background checks & screening by interview, including questions that delve psychologically into how they person feels about the society they are entering & describing how they intend to contribute. A Heinlein model of citizenship.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. Russ Erickson‏ @Russ_Erickson Jan 7
        Replying to @Russ_Erickson @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Maybe the trouble with decades of accentuating diversity is we don’t teach unity now. In my youth we learned simply about social fabric concepts e.g. singing together the “national” songs. Whether that be Land of Hope and Glory or Waltzing Matilda. Social fabric is woven.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Russ Erickson‏ @Russ_Erickson Jan 7
        Replying to @Russ_Erickson @HPluckrose @premodernism

        There is a middle ground between jingoistic, fascism and history revisised to assign guilt and national self-loathing

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      5. End of conversation
      1. OGB #FBPE‏ @OlGingerBastard Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Progressives (not my choice of term but the accepted label for the group being described here) also promote multiculturalism, and that is a disastrous policy when the cultures being encouraged are homophobic, misogynistic and anti-secular - Islam being the prime example

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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      1. OGB #FBPE‏ @OlGingerBastard Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Progressives encourage illegal immigration, and that's the real problem. If you don't agree with immigration policy, then work to change the policy, encouraging illegal immigration or being an apologist for it is never the answer.

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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      1. New conversation
      2. Ania Kovas‏ @aniakovas Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        These are always hard ideas, and people seem to take such an un-nuanced and fixed view. I would like to know exactly what definition of the word "liberalism" you're subscribing to here. (If you could point to one single example even?) Just for the sake of argument. So to speak.

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. SuperSecretSigma‏ @Eidotheia Jan 7
        Replying to @aniakovas @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Liberalism, in a classical sense, usually is an anti-authoritarian individualist and universalist stance. Typically it rejects state control over culture and rejects cultural control over behavior. Blank slatism is usually a requirement for universalism.

        2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      4. Ania Kovas‏ @aniakovas Jan 8
        Replying to @Eidotheia @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Found this a bit late in my replies. Alright, that makes sense. Now, I always end up saying that the is a tension between liberalism, as defined here and the responsibility of the state, and consequentially the responsibility of the individual to the state. (1 of 2 maybe?)

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      5. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. Voight  🌐‏ @Voight_Kampff_4 Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        I don't think they could persuade all immigrants to be racist. But even if they could, the bulk of the UK public don't give a toss about race. They live together and have families together. We'll be a nation of mixed race people long before progressives manage to cause a race war

        1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      3. SuperSecretSigma‏ @Eidotheia Jan 7
        Replying to @Voight_Kampff_4 @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Doesn't really need to end in a race war. Check the racial division on political issues and apply some thinking. If races/ethnicities are wildly divided on their views, some group will always be dissatisfied with society. With enough numbers, they'll change society.

        2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      4. Voight  🌐‏ @Voight_Kampff_4 Jan 8
        Replying to @Eidotheia @HPluckrose @premodernism

        I see your point about voting patterns and corrupt parties using immigration But I'm not too worried about UK. Fastest growing racial group here is mixed-race. I can't see people that have white people in their family, voting to disadvantage white people. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2245406/Jessica-Ennis-hailed-face-todays-Britain-census-figures-reveal-mixed-race-rise.html …pic.twitter.com/V9ooKVus3h

        0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
      5. End of conversation
      1. Ania Kovas‏ @aniakovas Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        ...look after everyone if there is a large influx and the state economy is challenged. (CF. Movement of refugees). I'd rather be a bit poorer and provide more sanctuary, what we used to call it), than not, but it can't be an unregulated thing and that's tricky and sad.

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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      1. Ania Kovas‏ @aniakovas Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        Good lord. I think it's easy to recognise, Helen, that there is an inherent dichotomy between liberalism and the state's responsibility to take care of the state's inhabitants; as well as between the idea of freedom to travel and settle and the ability of the state to...(sorry)

        0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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      1. SuperSecretSigma‏ @Eidotheia Jan 7
        Replying to @HPluckrose @premodernism

        I said we need to stop importing RACIALLY TRIBAL groups. If racial tribalists want SocJus, then the SAME QUESTION remains unanswered. How do you convince racial tribalists of ANYTHING when their primary concern is benefit to their race? The ideas are entirely inflatable.

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