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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 26

      Helen Pluckrose Retweeted

      This is why I reject the idea that parents own their children to the extent that those children do not have the rights of citizens. When parents abuse & endanger their children, the state must be able to take them away and protect them as British citizens with human rights. https://twitter.com/Legal_Equality/status/1055718997071605760 …

      Helen Pluckrose added,

      This Tweet is unavailable.
      14 replies 9 retweets 67 likes
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    2. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 26

      I cannot accept that my rights are only protected because my parents decided not to beat me, mutilate me or take me to a religious war zone. I should have had the right to know that if they'd tried, my country would have recognised me as an individual with rights & protected me.

      4 replies 2 retweets 44 likes
      Show this thread
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 26

      I'm afraid I think the few people claiming children of British Muslims who take them to ISIS do not have the rights of British citizens are full of shit & wld instantly recognise the rights of a child of culturally Christian parents to be protected from equivalent parental abuse

      12:35 AM - 26 Oct 2018
      • 2 Retweets
      • 28 Likes
      • mordhorst Inge Emma Gorowski Spooky Cavy AtticusOz Rebecca Christiansen 🍂🍁 g Oliver Cash Don't booOOoo vote! ⚰
      6 replies 2 retweets 28 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Kirsty Miller‏ @juscallmekirsty Oct 27
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          Do you not think though that the notion of ‘citizenship’ should only apply to those who do not want to destroy the country they are citizens of? ...

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Kirsty Miller‏ @juscallmekirsty Oct 27
          Replying to @juscallmekirsty @HPluckrose

          I get your point re the children, but just because it’s not their fault who their parents are, does that mean that we should willingly let potential threats back into the country?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 27
          Replying to @juscallmekirsty

          Would you normally let kids keep their citizenship if they'd had an awful childhood and were more likely than kids with good parents to commit crime?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. Kirsty Miller‏ @juscallmekirsty Oct 27
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          I know what you're saying, but I do feel like this is slightly different, because there is an ideological issue here: it's not just bad parenting, they (the parents) left the UK to join an organisation whose aim it is to destroy the UK...

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        6. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 27
          Replying to @juscallmekirsty

          And that isn't the kids' fault and they don't stop being British because their parents were traitors to it. We just don't punish kids for the crimes of their parents anymore even when it's treason because we've developed a liberal ethic of individual responsibility.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. Kirsty Miller‏ @juscallmekirsty Oct 27
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          Ultimately I think that this is the main issue - should we hold kids responsible for their parents behaviour, to which the answer is obviously no...

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Kirsty Miller‏ @juscallmekirsty Oct 27
          Replying to @juscallmekirsty @HPluckrose

          However, I wonder if the relevant question here is not 'should the kids be held responsible', to 'is allowing high risk people back into the UK too great a risk, given their parentage, their upbringing, and the society they've been brought up in...'?

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        9. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 27
          Replying to @juscallmekirsty

          Answering questions pragmatically without recourse to ethics results in an unethical system. We can reduce risks to society in many ways by denying rights to certain people who present higher risks but doing so would result in an unjust society which does not value the individual

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        10. 3 more replies
        1. New conversation
        2. Chibi Thomas Jefferson's Ghost‏ @PixyMisa Oct 26
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          I think you'll find that everyone agrees that these women should have been arrested for trying to join ISUS in the first place.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 26
          Replying to @PixyMisa

          Of course. That's not in dispute.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. End of conversation
        1. What_on_earth’s_going_on?‏ @jeremiah_allsop Oct 26
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          I'm not against the children being allowed back, but I am against the parents being allowed back. Is this your view?

          0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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        1. PragmaticLibertarian‏ @parallel235 Oct 26
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          What do you mean by “citizen”? I thought you were subjects. More seriously, citizenship should be more than just a piece of paper allowing you to live and vote in a country. It should require a certain loyalty to one’s fellow citizens at least. This certainly doesn’t apply here

          0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
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        1. Jay & Violent Mob, Insert Tribal Identity Here‏ @JAndViolentMob Oct 26
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          There's a real muddiness in there, of race, religion, and national identity.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
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        1. Trump puts the POS in POTUS  🇺🇸‏ @GrouchoMarx1011 Oct 26
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          While I agree with the sentiment, it is unclear where the line is. If Russian parents decided to take the UK kids to Russia and the UK is in conflict with Russia, does the state’s authority supersede that of the parents’?

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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