I sent you an essay. I recognise the objective material reality that biological sex is bimodal in teams of reproductive systems, yes, but also that gender comes from a variety of other biological aspects like brains, hormones, genetics etc.
I mean the science of it is new. Obviously, you can advocate for only going by reproductive systems for ethical or political reasons but this won't make the reality that people who feel the opposite sex to their gonads exist or the science which is starting to show why go away.
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"This is what we've always believed so why stop now?' is a terrible reason for taking a position when there is now more to be known. If your fear is for women's rights if we acknowledge that trans identity is real & rooted in biology, this can addressed w/out denial of biology.
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But why ‘stop believing’? Sex is by definition about reproductive capability. Suddenly, the ‘science is new’. What science? Again, what compelling reason do we have for not adopting my position (a) - just stating that someone has a false belief?
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Just say that then. That, for you, sex is just about reproductive systems so you'll divide people that way. Meanwhile, the science will go on discovering that actually brains and hormones etc are sexed too and trans people have those more like the opposite sex to their genitals.
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So trans women with intact male bodies can and do ‘father’ children; where does this reproductive reality fit in your view?
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It's a reproductive reality?
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Male and female are sexual reproductive categories. When the law refers to men and women this is what it means. You seem to be arguing for gender identity to be the legal definition resulting in ‘women’ ‘fathering’ children. It’s quite irrational.
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OK. You think that and dismiss me then. I really can't be bothered to argue about it any more.
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I’m not putting forward a theory; it’s an observation. How do you reconcile the two?
End of conversation
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Helen, do you think that people feel the opposite sex because they are comparing their own behaviours/preferences with those of other people, or do you believe that if a trans person was on a desert island they'd still think there was a mismatch between their body & mind?
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No. That wouldn't cause them to have different amounts of white & grey matter more similar to the other sex, differences in hormones, genetics or response to pheromones. Of course, some people are ideological fakes or confused but trans people exist.
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Is this a reply to me? To be clear, I'm not asking if trans ppl are fakes, of course I believe trans ppl exist. I'm asking why (in your understanding) someone will feel like the opposite sex. What tells them this is the case? A butch lesbian is not a trans man, for example.
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Yes. I just said why above.
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We still don't understand it very well but the evidence that trans people feeling the opposite sex to their gonads is rooted in biology is growing. More importantly, society needs to figure out how to make this easier for trans people without contravening any women's rights.
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James Cantor, if I understand him right, thinks that ppl have biologically rooted preferences/behaviours, but that whether they interpret these as meaning they're trans is due largely to socialisation. Do you think that's likely, or relevant?
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Certainly, in many cases. For example, I have a friend who has felt that she was male for as long as she can remember but because she believes gender to be a cultural construct & considers herself a radical feminist, she continues to identify as a woman & oppose trans acceptance.
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This doesn't stop her presenting herself as typically male in her dress and body-language and being taken to be a man by many people. She doesn't consider this the same thing as her lesbianism and most lesbians do not feel as tho they are really men.
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A feeling is not a material reality. And as you reference science you surely know that the ladybrain hypothesis, has been debunked. Additionally,so far, trans ppl show the same rate and pattern of offending as their sex. Which afaic means sex based safeguarding must continue.
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