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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 22
      Replying to @lecanardnoir

      I sent you an essay. I recognise the objective material reality that biological sex is bimodal in teams of reproductive systems, yes, but also that gender comes from a variety of other biological aspects like brains, hormones, genetics etc.

      3 replies 2 retweets 7 likes
    2. David Smith‏ @theedwardian81 Oct 22
      Replying to @HPluckrose @lecanardnoir

      Andy, are you sure you aren't doubling down a little too hard here? Having known you through skeptical stuff for years and Helen's views widely disseminated and dissected the last few weeks.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    3. Andy Lewis‏ @lecanardnoir Oct 22
      Replying to @theedwardian81 @HPluckrose

      I know, I am surprised I am here too right now. The disputable concepts of gender appear to come through various fashionable nonsense ideologies of the various pomo-style theories. So, I am just fascinated as to where this might lead?

      2 replies 0 retweets 12 likes
    4. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 22
      Replying to @lecanardnoir @theedwardian81

      We've always done this in one way or another. If "He is a feminine man" makes sense to you, you too instinctively see gender as something different to biological organs. It's annoying to discuss and attempt to define sharply tho so I tend not to get into it.

      4 replies 1 retweet 3 likes
    5. Andy Lewis‏ @lecanardnoir Oct 22
      Replying to @HPluckrose @theedwardian81

      I think these terms like sex and gender, male and female are deserving of analytical definitions, not loose handwaving that may be masking fallacies, errors and nonsense. Protections and rights surely depend on this.

      2 replies 2 retweets 8 likes
    6. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 22
      Replying to @lecanardnoir @theedwardian81

      And people make them. We just can't enforce them on everyone or agree on them and so the meaning generally remains a vague & fluffy "characteristics, identities & behaviours which are associated with sex but are not biological organs."

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    7. Andy Lewis‏ @lecanardnoir Oct 22
      Replying to @HPluckrose @theedwardian81

      Is that another way of saying there are no stable meanings to these words? And if so, how are you not erasing the concept of ‘woman’ as having an objective, material meaning?

      1 reply 0 retweets 9 likes
    8. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 22
      Replying to @lecanardnoir @theedwardian81

      The reality is that there is no stable meanings to these words, yes. If there were, you'd not be arguing to me that gender doesn't make sense because it would. I didn't make the reality and pretending it doesn't exist won't produce an objective, material meaning.

      3 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. Andy Lewis‏ @lecanardnoir Oct 22
      Replying to @HPluckrose @theedwardian81

      Last point. It is getting late. Yes, people may have different definitions. We might swap and compare them. Those definitions may evolve over time even. But, that is very different from people being *unable* to offer a coherent, material meaning for words - and yet still use them

      3 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 22
      Replying to @lecanardnoir @theedwardian81

      There's also just the fact that we don't know everything. It is OK to say we don't know when we don't. Maybe one day we can divide all the stuff we currently call 'gender' into brain stuff, hormone stuff, socialised stuff & individual stuff but right now, its a mess.

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 22
      Replying to @HPluckrose @lecanardnoir @theedwardian81

      We just have to do the best we can knowing that it is unsatisfactorily messy and vague. Some people like messineas. Like you, I hate it & want to tidy it and make it clear but I think its a mistake to reach conclusions without all the facts.

      4:11 PM - 22 Oct 2018
      • 1 Like
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      0 replies 0 retweets 1 like

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