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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 21

      Some of the defenses I hear of Brexit strike me as amazingly similar to those of communism. This speaks to a big noble ideal so it doesn't matter much if, in practice, everyone is poorer and nothing works properly. We're not motivated by economics. It's the principle.

      21 replies 20 retweets 75 likes
      Show this thread
    2. Chris K-B #StandUp4Brexit‏ @LBSProtect Oct 21
      Replying to @HPluckrose

      1. Leaving the EU. 2. Setting up a system of government in which all economic and social activity is controlled by the state acting through the medium of a single authoritarian political party, with the purported aim of realising the doctrines of revolutionary Marxism. NOT SAME

      2 replies 0 retweets 7 likes
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose Oct 21
      Replying to @LBSProtect

      Of course not. The argument is the same. Not the things they describe. That's what makes it particularly ironic.

      9:30 AM - 21 Oct 2018
      • 6 Likes
      • Lasse Jokela mumbogumshoe Michael Smith Yenrap Rellin Arthur Dent Jamie Woodhouse
      3 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. AhmNee Marcus‏ @AhmNee Oct 21
          Replying to @HPluckrose @LBSProtect

          The UK should not continue to be part of an undemocratic federal state that was never designed to govern, being created with neither sufficient checks & balances on power, nor accountability to the governed. Not really seeing the similarities.

          1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
        3. Meetal 'Maiden Blood' Leeka‏ @Meetal_Leeka Oct 22
          Replying to @AhmNee @HPluckrose @LBSProtect

          1/ It's not undemocratic, though. The leaders of each country, all elected democratically, meet regularly to decide the direction of the EU. The EU Commission is comprised of commissioners selected by each member country, and ensure the legislation and treaties are carried out.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. Meetal 'Maiden Blood' Leeka‏ @Meetal_Leeka Oct 22
          Replying to @Meetal_Leeka @AhmNee and

          2/ The Council of Ministers represents national governments, and is comprised of cabinet ministers from each country, each of whom are democratically elected in member countries. If a health issue is being discussed, the health ministers will convene, the same for trade, etc.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        5. Meetal 'Maiden Blood' Leeka‏ @Meetal_Leeka Oct 22
          Replying to @Meetal_Leeka @AhmNee and

          3/ The ministers enact legislation. The EU Parliament consists of MEPs democratically elected by member states. We currently have around 10% of them, a substantial voice in Europe. They have the right to accept, amend, or reject most EU legislation. Their voice is important.

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        6. Meetal 'Maiden Blood' Leeka‏ @Meetal_Leeka Oct 22
          Replying to @Meetal_Leeka @AhmNee and

          End/ To me, this all looks not that different to how our own government works. We have plenty of unelected bureaucrats, civil servants, and even an entire unelected House of Lords, for which we have never had a say. In fact, the EU looks more democratic to me, not less.

          2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        7. AhmNee Marcus‏ @AhmNee Oct 22
          Replying to @Meetal_Leeka @HPluckrose @LBSProtect

          The unelected EU council is the only body who can propose new legislation. They are under no obligation to revisit bad laws. If you have an incompetent/corrupt/authoritarian council member(s), there is no mechanism for you to unseat them.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        8. Meetal 'Maiden Blood' Leeka‏ @Meetal_Leeka Oct 22
          Replying to @AhmNee @HPluckrose @LBSProtect

          The Council of Ministers IS elected, though. Each member state elects a government, and the cabinet ministers of each comprise the Council. Every cabinet member is a serving MP, each of whom are elected only as MPs. We only indirectly decide who our own cabinet is.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        9. AhmNee Marcus‏ @AhmNee Oct 22
          Replying to @Meetal_Leeka @HPluckrose @LBSProtect

          All of which insulates them from accountability to the people over whom they govern. These aren't appointees to some facet of the bureaucracy. This is the sole body who proposes new laws, unanswerable to the public.

          0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        10. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. Chris K-B #StandUp4Brexit‏ @LBSProtect Oct 21
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          There are very few political positions which afford absolute primacy to economic prosperity though. All of us believe certain things to be more important than money in the life of our nation don't we? Seems unfair to single out Leavers and compare them to commies.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        3. Yenrap Rellin‏ @sisboombahbah Oct 21
          Replying to @LBSProtect @HPluckrose

          I think you could say that they’re worse than “commies”. Communists are wrong but they mean well. They want to share the planets resources. Brexit people just want some old fashioned nationalism that left to two world wars & a useless monarchy. Both wrong. Not the same.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Chris K-B #StandUp4Brexit‏ @LBSProtect Oct 21
          Replying to @sisboombahbah @HPluckrose

          It's a point of view Yenrap... is about all I can say in response to that.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. End of conversation
        1. Demétre‏ @Manolakos28 Oct 21
          Replying to @HPluckrose

          Problem is the system of Government provided by the EU is much worse. The UK has a time tested government structure that can overcome.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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