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HPluckrose's profile
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
Helen Pluckrose
@HPluckrose

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Helen Pluckrose

@HPluckrose

Editor @AreoMagazine Secular, liberal humanist. Mother. Doglover. Writing book about epistemology & ethics on the academic left Helen.pluckrose@areomagazine.com

London.
areomagazine.com/author/hpluckr…
Joined August 2011

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    1. A pseudonymous liar‏ @thatyellowfog May 27
      Replying to @Manglewood @nberlat and

      I'm supposed to take seriously a man who tells people what to do based on what lobsters do, and gets even that wrong? What are these empirically correct statements which he's supposed to have made? Honestly curious.

      3 replies 0 retweets 15 likes
    2. Kareem Sabri‏ @kareem_sabri May 27
      Replying to @thatyellowfog @Manglewood and

      It's inaccurate to claim the man has made no correct statements, or no empirical statements. And it's naive and foolish to consider him stupid, as many people do. I don't know about "empirically correct", but his discussion of the gender pay gap is certainly empirically grounded.

      2 replies 0 retweets 11 likes
    3. gz (not a doctor) thompson‏ @gztstatistics May 27

      what?! his discussion of the gender pay gap is where he gets precipitously owned by actual economists.

      2 replies 0 retweets 16 likes
    4. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 27
      Replying to @gztstatistics @kareem_sabri and

      Actual economists debunk the gender pay gap routinely!

      4 replies 1 retweet 28 likes
    5. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
      Replying to @HPluckrose @gztstatistics and

      This isn't true. @PikaGoldin doesn't debunk the wage gap - she's one of the people who has found the best evidence for it. See Golsina and Rouse: https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/aer.90.4.715 …

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    6. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 28
      Replying to @besttrousers @gztstatistics and

      I keep being sent the musicians thing. I send the one showing blind applications benefit women in STEM in response.

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
    7. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
      Replying to @HPluckrose @gztstatistics and

      The linked paper you did is hypothetical. It doesn't match the findings with actual hires. It's important to look at the overall field, not cherry pick studies that agree with youn

      1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
    8. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 28
      Replying to @besttrousers @gztstatistics and

      We could both say that to each other. Let's not. If you can show men and women getting paid different amounts for the same jobs for the same hours, I'll believe that is happening.

      1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
    9. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
      Replying to @HPluckrose @gztstatistics and

      Helen, again that wouldn't actually prove anything. Women and men make *choices* about how much they work.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    10. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
      Replying to @besttrousers @HPluckrose and

      Those choices occur very late on the causal path.

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 28
      Replying to @besttrousers @gztstatistics and

      They are what matters. Whether people's circumstances depend on their own choices. In the same way, we only need worry about more men being in prison if this is not related to choices made by men. Where those choices occur on the causal chain is largely irrelevant.

      1:53 AM - 28 May 2018
      • 2 Likes
      • Intersectional Snark Web
      2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
          Replying to @HPluckrose @gztstatistics and

          Helen, that's simply not true. Please read the statistics textbooks I linked earlier, or the Blau and Kahn review, which says the same thing:pic.twitter.com/hjEfpmLpF6

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        3. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 28
          Replying to @besttrousers @gztstatistics and

          It's not true that the wage gap is only a problem if it isn't chosen freely?

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        4. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
          Replying to @HPluckrose @gztstatistics and

          You are confusing moral and statistical issues. The wage gap isn't a problem if it's chosen freely, but the regression model you are advocating for does not demonstrate it is chosen freely

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. Adam Kolasinski‏ @adamckolasinski May 28
          Replying to @besttrousers @HPluckrose and

          Research-active economist here. The models used to analyze the wage gap cannot tell whether sex differences in occupation are due to women being shut out of some professions or due to women's preferences. Other evidence is needed to distinguish between those hypotheses.1/

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        6. Adam Kolasinski‏ @adamckolasinski May 28
          Replying to @adamckolasinski @besttrousers and

          IMHO, the Scandinavian data on occupational choice, with which Helen is familiar, provide strong evidence that the preference hypothesis explains most sex differences in occupation. But, as is typical in economics, we can't completely rule out the other hypothesis. 2/

          0 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        7. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. Helen Pluckrose‏ @HPluckrose May 28
          Replying to @HPluckrose @besttrousers and

          People suggest that women work more or men work less to get rid of the pay gap but the pay gap itself is only a problem if men or women are limited in their choices..https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/may/10/help-men-work-less-to-close-gender-pay-gap-says-thinktank …

          1 reply 1 retweet 3 likes
        3. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
          Replying to @HPluckrose @gztstatistics and

          Yes, and if their choices are limited then we can not include them as statistical controls. Imagine controlling for occupation in the 1950s. You would find no wage gap. It's a meaningless regression.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        4. John A. Boudet‏ @JohnBoudet May 28
          Replying to @besttrousers @HPluckrose and

          The fact that you’d have to “go back to the 1950’s” rather makes the point. You couldn’t validly “correct for profession” when comparing pay by gender in the ‘50s because entire fields were closed to women. But that’s no longer the case.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
          Replying to @JohnBoudet @HPluckrose and

          Yes, but I'm making a point about regressions. You can't claim an absence of discrimination on the basis of a regression that would show the same thing under circumstances where there is discrimination.

          1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
        6. John A. Boudet‏ @JohnBoudet May 28
          Replying to @besttrousers @HPluckrose and

          It’s very doable. You can validly compare the rate of pay of, say, respiratory therapists in Houston, right? And nurse anesthetists in Cleveland? And junior accountants in Miami? And we can then see whether, there is a gender gap, after correcting for hours, seniority, etc.

          1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
        7. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
          Replying to @JohnBoudet @HPluckrose and

          John, you can't do that without invalidating your analysis. Including those occupational controls incorporates a selection bias into your regression.

          1 reply 0 retweets 2 likes
        8. John A. Boudet‏ @JohnBoudet May 28
          Replying to @besttrousers @HPluckrose and

          Ha! There it is. The classic untestable hypothesis! “You can’t disprove my claim of a persistent, discrimination-based gender gap because discrimination is so pervasive that the effect can’t be measured.” It’s brilliant.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        9. Matt Darling  🌐‏ @besttrousers May 28
          Replying to @JohnBoudet @HPluckrose and

          No, you can test it directly with experiments.

          1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
        10. 9 more replies

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