And I see very few people (possibly not any!) arguing that the lack of women in that particular field is caused by hiring discrimination specifically, as opposed to general hostility to women or other factors.
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Replying to @cjbanning @iamcuriousblue and
That’s even less empirical. We can prove/disprove discrimation with gender blind testing. “General hostility” though..
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Replying to @kareem_sabri @iamcuriousblue and
"Harder to measure" and "less empirical" aren't really the same thing.
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Replying to @cjbanning @iamcuriousblue and
No, they’re not. Are you aware of any measurements of this general hostility?
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Replying to @kareem_sabri @iamcuriousblue and
I'm not disagreeing that it might be difficult to measure.
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Replying to @cjbanning @iamcuriousblue and
It seems dubious to posit "general hostility" as a causal factor for lack of women in engineering without being able to at least verify it exists. Women are quite well represented in certain departments in tech (HR for example).
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Replying to @kareem_sabri @cjbanning and
Well, quite. There was hostility to women entering all kinds of professions and yet they quickly came to dominate many of the fields which require an interest in people and communication and made much lesser inroads into those which require interest in things and systemising.
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Replying to @HPluckrose @kareem_sabri and
Given that this is consistent with differences observed all over the world, in babies too young to have been socialised out of any interests, in other apes, to manifest far less in lesbian & gay people and to be experienced as a change by trans people taking hormones...
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Replying to @HPluckrose @kareem_sabri and
...it does seem likely that men and women are not cognitively & psychologically identical and that no matter how much you offer women opportunities to make the same choices as men in the same numbers, we still might decline to do so because men are not the default humans.
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Replying to @HPluckrose @kareem_sabri and
It seems likely but the actual research seems to indicate that we know less than we think about what those differences actually are, objectively, and what we think we know is often wrong. Again, we need more and better studies.
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It would be a good start if we were allowed to mention the masses of evidence we already have without risk of getting fired like Damore. It's not that the info isn't out there & replicated time and time again.https://heterodoxacademy.org/the-most-authoritative-review-paper-on-gender-differences/ …
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