I don’t claim that ketogenic diets are shown to decrease MACE. Yet the zealots say fiber and antioxidants and phytonutrients provide magic. The data just isn’t there. They have done RCTs no effect seen
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Replying to @DoctorTro @EAllen0417
I've yet to see anyone claim magic aside from the tabloids, but they claim magic for everything. I agree that there are no RCTs demonstrating the benefits in terms of MACE/ACM but that's a bit of a straw man because it's practically impossible to conduct one
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Replying to @GidMK @EAllen0417
They have done it! Vitamins, antioxidants, fiber has all been tested in randomized interventional trials with UNDERWHELMING performance.
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Replying to @DoctorTro @EAllen0417
Oh certainly, as individual supplements. Antioxidants in particular have been shown to be useless as supplements. The question of whole foods is less easy to answer, however
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Replying to @GidMK @EAllen0417
So you think that the vitamins, fiber and antioxidants when in a plant magically have more of an effect? Help me with occumz razor here
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Replying to @GidMK @EAllen0417
“The question of Whole Foods” what did you mean by that
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Replying to @DoctorTro @EAllen0417
Whether the effect of foods, which are far more complex than, say, anthocyanin pills, has more of an effect than each isolated ingredient in pharmaceutical form
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An example might be that there is no consistent evidence that protein supplementation is effective for most things, but that doesn't mean that steak is a waste of time
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Replying to @GidMK @EAllen0417
I didnt say that whole plant foods were a waste of time, did I ?
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True. I'd definitely agree that most supplements are a waste of time. My original point, that RCTs by design mostly can't assess ACM/MACE is also worth remembering
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Replying to @GidMK @EAllen0417
My point is any benefit from WFPB is not from vitamins, antioxidants or fiber, it’s merely from displacing terrible food
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