A friend said something I thought was insightful that people should hear. He did not want to post this openly himself, though. Really says something about the level of intellectual honesty in contemporary Buddhist discourse, no? Anyway, posting because I think it's useful. 1/6
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Look, it's better than trying to work angles like "he SAID that, but he musn't have REALLY MEANT THAT." Come on. Fucker said, fucker meant.
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By the way, if you read the quote again, all he said was that he "found it useful" to consider the words as a teaching rather than a metaphysical assertion. I think this is where we got off the rails.
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One can play Dzogchen philosophy without ever actually recognizing the nature of mind as practice. One doesn't need to play Dzogchen philosophy to recognize the nature of mind as practice. This makes no claim about what he did or didn't literally mean in a metaphysical sense.
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There is a danger of people playing metaphysical language games, thinking they are practicing Dzogchen, but not gaining any insight. It is therefore more *useful* to take his words as teachings, if the goal is liberation.
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This doesn't rule out the possibility that his statements were also literally metaphysical in nature. Maybe you're right about that. I would just posit that this is a separate inquiry.
End of conversation
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Yes, in a lucid dream.
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That was a clever response, but it's one I've heard a thousand times over from Rabbis who believe the world to be 6,000 years old. And if Shakyamuni himself told me in a lucid dream that Dudjom Lingpa was full of shit, what then?
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Did he? Did Shakyamuni himself tell you in a lucid dream Dudjom Lingpa was full of shit? No. Then, I suggest you wait TILL IT HAPPENS MOTHERFUCKER.
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Fine. He told me in a non-lucid dream. Guess I'll have to get back to you after I summon him in a lucid dream and my subconscious has him tell me what I want to hear.
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You know nobody told you shit. You're guessing. You haven't woken up. Do the work, fucking wake up, & then teach, you idiot.
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Did Dudjom Lingpa disclose to you my level of progress on the path in that same lucid dream, or was it a different one? Did he tell you that I haven't woken up? Or is your assessment grounded in your desire to be right?
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No, I'm just going by your sarcastic shit.
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Hard to have an earnest discussion with someone who communicates with rage. The way I tend to respond to that is with sarcasm. Perhaps I need to work on that. Maybe you can work on your anger and unquestioning certitude of your suspicions about others' experience in the meantime.
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