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DocEdge85's profile
Doc Edge
Doc Edge
Doc Edge
@DocEdge85

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Doc Edge

@DocEdge85

Postdoc with Graham Coop at UC Davis. Population genetics, statistics, music.

doc-edge.net
Joined November 2015

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    Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

    (1) Here's an explainer thread on our new paper on the difficulties of interpreting polygenic score differences between populations. Paper w/ Noah Rosenberg, @jkpritch, and Marc Feldman, but speaking for myself here:https://academic.oup.com/emph/advance-article/doi/10.1093/emph/eoy036/5262222 …

    5:15 PM - 4 Jan 2019
    • 260 Retweets
    • 544 Likes
    • ricar∂o Oktay I. Kaplan Tobiloba Oni Mike McLaren Alexey Guzey Lindy McBride Global Gene Corp hmmmmmm HennLab
    8 replies 260 retweets 544 likes
      1. New conversation
      2. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (2) With so much genome-wide association study (GWAS) data becoming available, it's become easy to compute mean polygenic scores for human populations for many traits, which are mean values of phenotypes predicted from genetic information.

        1 reply 1 retweet 28 likes
        Show this thread
      3. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (3) The most straightforward way to compute a mean polygenic score is to take a weighted sum of allele frequencies, where the weights are effect size estimates from GWAS.

        1 reply 1 retweet 23 likes
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      4. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (4) (Most polygenic scores aren't very accurate as trait predictions right now, but the accuracy will go up as GWAS progresses.)

        2 replies 1 retweet 23 likes
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      5. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (5) As it's easy to compute mean polygenic scores, You can imagine people finding that group A has a higher mean polygenic score for, say, height, than group B, and then saying things like "group A is taller than group B for genetic reasons" or "x% of the height gap is genetic".

        1 reply 2 retweets 29 likes
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      6. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (6) These kinds of inferences are slipshod for a lot of reasons, and our goal was to collect those reasons and put them in one commentary. Our sense is that people working in the field know these things, but we wanted to go on record before misinterpretations proliferate.

        1 reply 4 retweets 52 likes
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      7. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (7) @Graham_Coop's awesome tea drinking post has a lot of overlap:https://gcbias.org/2018/03/14/polygenic-scores-and-tea-drinking/ …

        2 replies 6 retweets 68 likes
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      8. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (8) So why are these inferences so slippery? A lot of the reasons have to do with how genes and environments interact to shape phenotypic variation, and are actually basically the same reasons that have been discussed widely since at least the 1970s by Lewontin, etc.

        1 reply 1 retweet 39 likes
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      9. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (9) In short, genetics doesn't necessarily work in a simple additive way that's constant across populations---there can be gene-gene interaction (epistasis), gene-environment interaction, and plain old environmental differences that swamp or even counter any genetic differences.

        2 replies 11 retweets 70 likes
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      10. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (10) These are all glosses for quite general classes of genotype-phenotype relationships: it can be really complicated.

        1 reply 1 retweet 24 likes
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      11. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (11) Beyond these conceptual issues, there are a lot of reasons to think that polygenic scores don't translate well between populations. @genetisaur's work has been a major touchpoint for a lot of us here, for example figures 2 and 3 here: https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2019/01/03/441261.full.pdf …

        1 reply 2 retweets 42 likes
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      12. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (12) Why do phenotype predictions developed from European populations perform less well in other places? We don't really know, but there are at least 5 possible reasons.

        1 reply 6 retweets 39 likes
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      13. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (13) i) correlations between genetic sites (i.e. LD patterns) vary across populations, meaning that a particular GWAS SNP may be correlated with different sets of causal variants in different populations. (e.g. figure 2 in the @genetisaur paper linked earlier).

        1 reply 2 retweets 33 likes
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      14. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (14) ii) Some variants that affect a phenotype in one population may not be variable in another population, making them impossible to map by GWAS in the population where they're fixed (i.e., not variable).http://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2017/10/11/science.aan8433 …

        1 reply 2 retweets 33 likes
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      15. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (15) iii) The original GWAS may have issues with uncorrected population stratification, which seems to have driven exaggerated signals of selection on height. https://www.biorxiv.org/content/early/2018/06/25/354951 … andhttps://www.biorxiv.org/content/early/2018/06/25/355057 …

        1 reply 2 retweets 34 likes
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      16. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (16) Differences in either (iv) genetic background or (v) environment may cause the effect sizes measured in GWAS to differ in different populations (epistasis and GxE again), as in the apparent epistasis in this ApoE4 story:https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1007791 …

        2 replies 4 retweets 34 likes
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      17. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (17) So all told, we just don't understand genotype-phenotype maps well enough to leap from current data to explanations of group differences.

        3 replies 13 retweets 44 likes
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      18. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (18) Further, even if a group difference is "genetic," that doesn't mean it's immutable---it might disappear in another environment. (Imagine a "genetic" difference in lipid levels that's erased in a world where everybody takes statins.)

        1 reply 5 retweets 47 likes
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      19. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (19) We also talk a bit about attempts to explain observed trait differences in terms of drift vs. selection. There are ways to test for selection on polygenic scores, but the tests are vulnerable to stratification, and there are further difficulties in interpretation.

        1 reply 3 retweets 24 likes
        Show this thread
      20. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4

        (20) Finally, we spend some time working through a sort of back-of-the envelope calculation regarding health disparities to give an example of the kinds of things one has to consider when approaching these questions. (end)

        6 replies 2 retweets 27 likes
        Show this thread
      21. End of conversation
      1. New conversation
      2. RCB‏ @RCB16746293 Jan 4
        Replying to @DocEdge85 @itsbirdemic @jkpritch

        I recently talked with a PhD student, who said currently available data suggests that nontrivial genetic contributions to group diffs in IQ are “highly unlikely”. I said too early to make that claim. It’s not the point of your paper, but I’m curious: do you share his assessment?

        1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
      3. RCB‏ @RCB16746293 Jan 4
        Replying to @RCB16746293 @DocEdge85 and

        Conversation motivated by recent article on Watson. Feel free to message me privately.

        1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
      4. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 4
        Replying to @RCB16746293 @itsbirdemic @jkpritch

        I'd say that until we have several generations with no wealth gap, no education gap, and no structural or personal racism, it's unproductive to speculate about the role of genetics in group IQ diffs. That sounds political, but you'd actually have to equalize the envs. to know.

        17 replies 25 retweets 141 likes
      5. Tim‏ @timpplex Jan 5
        Replying to @DocEdge85 @RCB16746293 and

        And even then it would tell us little about the effects of some new, as yet untested environment, which is often the main object.

        1 reply 0 retweets 5 likes
      6. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 5
        Replying to @timpplex @RCB16746293 and

        Yes, have been meaning to bring this up---even once you equalize environments, you don't know how things would look in a new environment unless you understand the mechanisms.

        1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
      7. Tim‏ @timpplex Jan 5
        Replying to @DocEdge85 @RCB16746293 and

        Your statin example is a good one. Or, eyeglasses. If humans had developed eugenics earlier, we would be faster, stronger, and sharper eyed today... the best hunters on the savanna.

        1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
      8. Doc Edge‏ @DocEdge85 Jan 5
        Replying to @timpplex @RCB16746293 and

        You lost me here. Eugenics is brutal and oppressive. We are already the "best hunters on the savanna" because of culture and technology. Is there supposed to be some appeal to having everybody run a quick 40 and have 20/10 vision?

        2 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
      9. Tim‏ @timpplex Jan 5
        Replying to @DocEdge85 @RCB16746293 and

        I was being sarcastic. We have become much more than best hunters on the savanna.

        2 replies 0 retweets 6 likes
      10. 1 more reply

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