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C7RKY's profile
John Clarke
John Clarke
John Clarke
@C7RKY

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John Clarke

@C7RKY

Of course views all mine. All without prejudice. Just a regular chap after all. Oh...and RT's may equally imply ridicule as endorsement.

UK
Joined December 2011

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    1. Jamie‏ @DrJimboNHS Feb 11
      Replying to @DrJimboNHS @C7RKY and

      ...at the moment the assessment is merely one of principle. In principle does that duty exist. The pragmatic reality is that in these overstretched over burdened environments, it is deeply compromised before you even step in there...

      1 reply 1 retweet 4 likes
    2. Jamie‏ @DrJimboNHS Feb 11
      Replying to @DrJimboNHS @C7RKY and

      ...the assessment of gross, and therefore the definition of the crime itself is also left to the jurors, which seems wrong. But the idea that a balanced assessment of individual culpability is properly explored against the systemic culpability is wrong...

      1 reply 1 retweet 2 likes
    3. Jamie‏ @DrJimboNHS Feb 11
      Replying to @DrJimboNHS @C7RKY and

      ...to truly know what the system contribution was, and therefore what the individual culpability is, requires a very thorough judicial exploration of the system & at the very least an independent one. Anything less allows the corporation & hierarchy to scapegoat the individual...

      1 reply 2 retweets 3 likes
    4. Jamie‏ @DrJimboNHS Feb 11
      Replying to @DrJimboNHS @C7RKY and

      ...and it is quite impossible and totally unrealistic to expect a defence team to be able to run that investigation through themselves, compelling organisational openness.

      1 reply 1 retweet 2 likes
    5. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @DrJimboNHS @GrumpyOldDoc and

      Morning! :) You’re right Jamie, I’m afraid we don’t agree on this area. But you raise multiple points in making your case, so let me try and cover them as best I can:

      1 reply 0 retweets 0 likes
    6. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

      I believe the duty of care does apply to an individual in this setting, even though I do agree that the environment should be taken into account. And if this image is correct, then it appears the legal process does indeed account for it via ‘the circumstances of the defendant’ >pic.twitter.com/lsPgLN29eT

      1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes
    7. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

      But as I’ve suggested previously, it’s entirely possible to be personally grossly negligent, even if placed in an environment that is inadequate. >

      2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
    8. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

      If one took a break for example and just didn’t bother coming back for a few hours, then one’s personal actions would be worthy of both blame and legal recourse for any consequences, regardless of environment.

      2 replies 0 retweets 1 like
    9. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

      Re assessing whether or not a breach has occurred, I’m happy to have jury do that personally, as it offers a societal view of that decision, not medical. But tho the jury may then also reach a decision as to whether that breach is gross, it’s worth examining that point closer >

      1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
    10. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

      In this graphic, it seems to me that someone has managed to slide a version of Bolam into criminal law, (something I’m not particularly happy to have discovered). >pic.twitter.com/kjbJxpXcwC

      2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
      John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
      Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

      But in any event, this suggests to me that medical expert witnesses will have persuaded the jury that a reasonable body of medical opinion did NOT exist to support her actions. They didn't reach their decision unaided.

      11:40 PM - 11 Feb 2018
      • 2 Likes
      • Kirsten Sjovoll Nick Argall
      3 replies 0 retweets 2 likes
        1. New conversation
        2. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
          Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

          Despite appearances from the current partially-informed debate, it’s seemingly apparent that clinicians in court with access to the full evidence felt her actions were indeed grossly negligent. >

          2 replies 0 retweets 3 likes
        3. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
          Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

          The medical world has built its own safety net into the law (perhaps explaining why there are so few prosecutions) and even that couldn’t save her. >

          4 replies 0 retweets 1 like
        4. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
          Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

          We don’t know what the mystery ‘2 systems issues’ were that the judge deemed inadmissible because of their irrelevance. We don’t know what other systems issues WERE raised in court.

          2 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
        5. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 11
          Replying to @C7RKY @DrJimboNHS and

          We don’t even know the full details of her errors. 21 or otherwise. And we certainly don’t know enough at this stage to assert that the law needs changing, imho. END Over to you... :)

          0 replies 1 retweet 3 likes
        6. End of conversation
        1. New conversation
        2. Jamie‏ @DrJimboNHS Feb 12
          Replying to @C7RKY @GrumpyOldDoc and

          We know an intensivist gave expert testimony for the prosecution. That is to say someone more senior who works in the most highly controlled, highly staffed environment judging a trainee who clearly wasn't. Not a fair judge IMHO.

          1 reply 0 retweets 4 likes
        3. Nick Argall‏ @nickargall Feb 12
          Replying to @DrJimboNHS @C7RKY and

          Sounds like the defense team could have benefited from your advice when doing their cross-examination.

          1 reply 0 retweets 1 like
        4. John Clarke‏ @C7RKY Feb 12
          Replying to @nickargall @DrJimboNHS and

          Indeed. The defence will have had chance to present their own choice of expert witnesses too, of course. As well as cross examine this one.

          0 replies 1 retweet 4 likes
        5. End of conversation
        1. Jamie‏ @DrJimboNHS Feb 12
          Replying to @C7RKY @GrumpyOldDoc and

          Tell me what body of medical evidence says such understaffing is safe? What body of evidence says what degree of cognitive fade is permissible? None and none would be my humble suggestions.

          0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes
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