Some ppl with dementia diagnoses I've supported through writing Advance Decisions recently (+some with MND+COPD) really hope to have a cardiac arrest so that they don't have to go through the later stages of "natural dying" of their illness.Need to be alert to this choice too.
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Replying to @KitzingerCelia @drkathrynmannix and
People who want to die in their sleep are actually hoping for a cardiac arrest in their sleep ... heart stops abruptly, no time to wake to feel faint, and gone .. so long as
#CPR not done to desecrate the scene - true story https://www.dropbox.com/s/rfwexskg173vsgv/Full%20Cardiopulmonary%20Resuscitation%20after%20Peaceful%20Dying.docx?dl=0 …@loisrogersnews3 replies 2 retweets 2 likes -
Replying to @doctorcaldwell @Trisha_the_doc and
Heart wrenching story, hopefully something that
@Ldn_Ambulance can reflect on. Crew should have felt empowered to not start had they been provided with that lady’s background. Highlights importance of communicating forwards any DNACPR discussions and decisions on discharge1 reply 0 retweets 3 likes -
Replying to @LiamS27 @doctorcaldwell and
I've had that 'you must attempt CPR' conversation with a 999 operator - well, in fact I said 'stop talking' at the 'look down the throat' instruction, when I had found my cousin dead in his home. So I didn't get as far as arguing over CPR.
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Replying to @MikeStone2_EoL @doctorcaldwell and
Sorry to hear that. Not an easy situation, which other callers may handle differently. Important to remember that call takers are just that, generally non-clinicians and are protocol driven with good reason. Unfortunately the protocols are difficult to break out of
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Replying to @LiamS27 @doctorcaldwell and
I would really like some 999 Ambulance Service Call Handlers to tweet their answers to 'what would they say next' in this situation: not 'our guidance is at wherever' - but 'if I followed my guidance, then I would say ...'.pic.twitter.com/72neqjiEZh
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Replying to @MikeStone2_EoL @LiamS27 and
I don't see why you couldn't copy that exact text onto a FOI request & ask that you be provided with all guidelines/training materials that are pertinent to the preparation of call handlers to answering that question. You might also ask for an indication of the model response too
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Ah - I could ask for the written guidance. But I want to get actual call handlers, who have read their own guidance and who have been trained, to tell us what they would actually say next - I'm pretty sure I can't technically ask for that, using an FOI.
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Replying to @MikeStone2_EoL @LiamS27 and
Probably not, but if you obtain the training material and guidelines, (and maybe even a model answer), you'll at least get a feel for what they're *supposed* to say. It's a good start point to then test how it compares to reality. Still of value, I'd say.
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It isn't certain, that I would get the guidance - and even if I did, 'to then test how it compares to reality' involves issues of 'interpretation'. I'd prefer to jump directly to 'what the call handlers would actually say next in my scenario' and analyse from that information.
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Fair enough. Though I suspect you're going to end up wanting that material at some point along this journey, even if not now. If only to explain why some are/are not saying what you would like.
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